2.7RSL @ H&H

[Nick Moss]

A good copy is as good performance wise as a real one, what ever that may be ,so why do people pay these ridiculous prices?

Wow, here we go with a 30 page thread! IMO people will pay more for the real thing as they aren't making new ones any more, but you're right, the driving experience in a good rep will be the same.

[Mike]

A good copy is as good performance wise as a real one, what ever that may be, so why do people pay these ridiculous prices?

where to start........

The key is as you say you can replicate the performance, but you can't replicate the history, and that is what you pay the big money for.
A proper built recreation will give you the driving sensation of the real thing, Josh Sadler said of my old RSL rep for instance that it drove
as well if not better than many originals, but of course it will always be a replica.

The original, one with the provenece, history and condition will not only be a delight to own and drive but will always be a very valuable
asset and good investment, so if you have the disposable cash it's a no brainer.

My current recreation when finished, (no laughing at the back there) I hope will be the epitome of driving experience, the chance to re-live
what it must have been like too be a 'werks' driver in a Martini team car at the Targa Florio, to feel the same power with the same throttle
response will take the replica to another level, but at the end of the day it comes down to one thing, I can't afford the million pounds the
real thing would cost!

[MikeB]

It's back to the aged old story of defining "original", esp on a competition car that has had many parts replaced through wear & tear, as well as a result of the odd prang.

But if this can trace its history back to competition, than for some (or most?) it has to be worth a bit more than a similarly "restored" road version.

Just as long as it's not a T chassis with an old chassis nr welded on.....now where have I heard that before

[left4dead]

... but at the end of the day it comes down to one thing, I can't afford the million pounds the real thing would cost!

Mike, I'm surprised you haven't surpassed this figure given the man hours you must be in to with your project!

In all seriousness though, your car will surely be better than any period 'werks' car and, as you say, will take so called 'replicas' to a whole new level and for this you are to be applauded.

Oh, and you have the patience of a saint!

[Gary71]

... but at the end of the day it comes down to one thing, I can't afford the million pounds the real thing would cost!

Mike, I'm surprised you haven't surpassed this figure given the man hours you must be in to with your project!

I think he must be on a bulk buy discount, 2 for 1 maybe...

[hot66]

... but at the end of the day it comes down to one thing, I can't afford the million pounds the real thing would cost!

Mike, I'm surprised you haven't surpassed this figure given the man hours you must be in to with your project!

In all seriousness though, your car will surely be better than any period 'werks' car and, as you say, will take so called 'replicas' to a whole new level and for this you are to be applauded.

Oh, and you have the patience of a saint!

don't the Ferrari lads call these 'tool room copies'


Anyway, this whole discussion about value & provenience can be applied to anything that's valuable / collectable ...... I'm sure you could exactly replicate a rembrandt for example, the painting will be as good as the original, but if that was the pure source of enjoyment you could buy a poster of it .. the enjoyment also comes from knowing it was originally conceived, created etc by rembrandt ......... maybe a poor example, but you know where I'm coming from.

The same argument as gone through my head with regards to my 2.4S .... I could build a S replica for less money, sell mine & pocket the difference ..... but sometimes it's not about the money. I love the fact someone went into a dealership , ordered my specific car, which was then built to spec in a factory I have visited . The history I have of my car , to me makes it all the more special. I love imagining back to 1973 when the 1st Italian Owner, at the age of 30, drove out of the Porsche dealership in a brand new bright yellow Porsche 911 2.4S ...... he chose it because it was an S & then kept the car for another 20 years.

[964RS]

But your S replica won't keep rising in price at the levels your real S is doing James so the 'cash in the pocket' argument soon becomes worthless over time.

[mogga911]

O.K. I hear what you all say I think this is a good example I have some pics but do not know how to post them[/img]

[Ferry Man]

O.K. I hear what you all say I think this is a good example I have some pics but do not know how to post them

Mogga, good to hear from you. If you want to mail pictures to me I can put them up for you. I've sent you a PM.

[Ferry Man]

I have some pics but do not know how to post them

This story has unfolded a little further with the fascinating input from 'mogga911'.
He has forwarded me some photographs and an anecdote of his recollections at the time.

These pictures were apparently taken in the late seventies after the car had been prepared by the second owner to compete in rallies.

[Ferry Man]

'mogga911' goes on to say:

"The parts on it were not as available as they are now, most were works bits.
The engine was 2.8L, gearbox was very close ratio and flat out was 115 m.p.h. @7200r.p.m. in top.
Its road accident was on a dual carriageway at 60m.p.h. when a woman in a Capri shot out about 40 feet away and stopped.
The impact must have been at about 40m.p.h. fortunately no one was badly hurt.
The 911 was trailered back and there was a long negotiation with the insurance company.
Eventually a settlement was made and another RS was purchased.
Could not find a light weight so an aubergine touring was purchased from the Isle of Man.
Then all the best bits from DWL transferred to the I.O.Man car including the engine and gearbox.
The I.O.Man car was then resprayed white.
The remains of DWV 911L and all the bits we did not need were then sold on for ---------- wait for it------- £1,700.
Sooo which bits did the circuit of Ireland? well, at least one of the doors,
instruments, steering wheel, gearlever, dash top, I could not be sure of the rest.
None of the descriptions of the car during the auction are untrue and the original engine could well have found its way back to the car at a later date.
The shell may well have been repaired but we did not think it viable for a competition car at the time, that’s why the insurance company paid out and we bought the salvage.

If cars with history are worth more this justifies the price as this car has a lot of history!!!"

[Ferry Man]

[left4dead]

Wow! Mogga911 no wonder you were surprised to see the photos on the H&H site - how different does the car looks these days? What a transformation! I love the fact that back then no one gave two hoots for originality and the cars were just used & abused for which, no doubt, they had been designed.

I'm sure the new owner would love to know this part of the car's history so let's hope someone tips him/her off about this thread (assuming they're not on here already but keeping a low profile after Vic's review of the car! )

Fascinating stuff. Love it.

Oh, one question? What happened to the Isle of Man car

[Vic Cohen]

Feeling better the more i read ......getting giggly............did nt dare mention the rumour the tub was nt a genuine lightweight ..............

Even the wife wud have to admit i amright soemtimes ..................guess just relieved in this case

[Nick Moss]

So the car sold at H&H has the registration DWV 911L and VIN 9113601101 fom the original LWT shell. The replacement was a Touring. I wonder whether they bothered to swap the build number over? If not then that may have spawned another car. What happened to the ID from the Touring ?