Restoration of a 356SC

[Peter Roberts]

I am about to embark on a major restoration of my 356. I have gone out for quotes for all the components i might need and am looking at the costs.
One thing on my list is a 12volt upgrade and i have been a little surprised as to the costs of items such as starter, regulator and dynamo.
What are my options on these items? I have been advised that on the starter i only need to change the solenoid as the coils on the motor are beefy enough to take 12v. Is the dynamo the same as a VW and could i source one second hand?. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

[40 scout]

Six is fine - change starter motor bush

Done over 20000 miles at 6 volt - all fine, dim headlights but all fine.

Steve

[marc500]

Agree 6v works fine - there will be plenty of other bills needing paying!

[mycar]

Ditto, my headlamps are bright and all electrics function very well on 6 volts.

I would advise going over all electrical connections, starting from the fuse panel, cleaning with wire wool/fine sand paper/brass brush as you go and if you're interested in your car's electrical system, order a copy of Joe Leoni's 'Electrical Schematics and Descriptions" for your particular model.

[Ashley James]

I'm on six volts and it's fine, but you can use a six volt starter on twelve if you can change.

[roy mawbey]

Agree with all the others 6 volt does work okay providing all earths are good the battery is in good condition and you can live with the old headlights. In the late 60's I bought two halogen 6 volt spot lamps which worked worked well. Off the car now as I don't use it at night now.

If the 6v starter is slow in any way hot or cold remember apart from the bell housing bush as scout says, the starter solinoid has contacts inside that are probably dirty. On my original starter these contacts are under a riveted cover. This can be removed to gain access. The repair of that by a good company ' Broadway Electrical services' in Essex transformed my 6v starting experience.

Correct above, the money spent on conversion could be used elsewhere to good advantage. ( How good is the underneath and body? )

Roy

[Peter Roberts]

I have had this car for 15 years and have never been happy with the starting. It chugs over very slowly and just when you think the battery has given up the ghost it bursts into life. Stater been rebuilt, bush in gearbox housing replaced, earths checked, new bigger battery installed etc etc. but it never improved. Its been off the road for a few years whilst i concentrated on other projects but now i am about to start and its going to be in bits it seems a good time to consider it. I had a RHD cabriolet ( which i sold at the wrong time) that had been upgraded to 12 volt and the starter on that just flew over, lights were bright and i never crossed my fingers whenever i turned the key.
A compromise may be to fit 2 x 6volt batteries which would remove my concern about the battery going flat before it fired. has anyone tried this option?

[53Scat]

One of the first changes I made to mine as I was never happy with the cranking speed and confidence in starting.
6v starter works fine with a 12v solenoid but youwillneedaresandexpensive12
Dynamo.
Well worth the benefits

[rocket280]

12v alternator conversions in stock. pm me for a UK price.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds ... id=1976234

[Burma-Shave]

^ satisfied customer of one of these kits here. I had all sorts of dynamo/regulator complications on my 12V C, haven't looked back with an alternator fitted.

[Winston Teague]

Ref the above kit, which looks like an effective soloution:presumably one could fit a large case VW Dynamo rather than the alternator, if you felt that the ugliness and modernness of the alternator was a step too far?.
My 356 came to me 12v. If it hadn't I'd have done it by now. I have a very early car to rewire over the winter, inc 12v conversion. For this I have sourced a v rare 12v 38a small case Dynamo. Tricky to find, and the best part of £300, plus another £100 or so for the correct 12v mechanical reg box, but that compares OK to the alternator conversion if you have a bit of time to track down the bits. I have the standard 6v starter which is quite happy (unlike the Powerlite hi torque I fitted which had the incorrect plunge depth and started to eat the flywheel teeth). H4 headlamp inserts, louder horns, resistor on the wiper motor (still too fast) and gauges (care needed here). New coil, bulbs, radio, etc. I'm working on a soloution for the wipers, 12v will fry your vari speed switch if you use it to slow down the motor enough.
W

[roy mawbey]

If its just a problem in the starter motor a good check of it could be worth while. You will not have the equipment to check armature and field windings and the problem of slow cranking could well be solinoid contacts. If the motor has no fault then it still could be earths did you check all of them? The connection to the battery box floor if it has a washer is it still correctly soldered to the floor? Rust had got underneath mine. Is the single wire from the solinoid to the starter oxidized? Might need cutting back. The transmission to chassis earth is perfect? I even checked the ignition switch as well as changing that bronze bushing. The old one ( original ) only had little wear on removal I checked with telescopic and micrometer against the new one. Your battery must be good of course.

The commutator and brushes would be checked too of course with the windings. Truly after years and years of swearing at my starter I cannot believe the difference after the solinoid points clean up was made. My car turns over as fast with 6v as my 12v BMW. I can say there is no difference.

http://www.broadwayelectrical.co.uk have a look on their website Rob is the man to speak to there tel:
01375 372 782 Maybe worth a check of the motor before going down other routes??

Roy

[Ignatzcatz]

Hey Rocket, you still up at Pease Pottage? Is your car done yet? Mine is, so there. BTW yer 12V conversion is The Dogs, I'm running a big stereo and a pair of Cibie spots, no problems.

[356Monkey]

6 volt is fine, as long as the dynamo, regulator and battery are in good shape, The previous post mentioned Rob and Broadway Electrical in Grays Essex, they are spot on (and also where most of the UK 356 parts people send their's to be done to sell on to you) The 12 volt dynamo has a different armature ( and is not the same as any beetle one) but sometimes they have second hand armatures and can modify yours. They also will rebuild your starter motor. Their work is fab and they restore them to look as near original as possible (again this is why the 356 parts suppliers use them) They can also test your voltage regulator to make sure it's behaving.

This is a common topic often kickstarted by the 'slower speed that the starter motor seems to turn'. This is mainly because we've all got used to 12 volt starters and modern cars, the 6 volt ones do turn slower - but they do the job as we intended.

So, speaking as someone nearing completion of the restoration of a 356c I'd suggest you save your money on this element - trust me, you'll need money to burn just for the cost of the resto work!!!

[S.J.Szabo]

Mr.Roberts:

To each his own, and if your price of masochism is "originality", stick with six.

The Trusty Coupe has been at 12v since I did the conversion in the mid-eighties, and I have never had reason to regret it.

The one advantage from doing the deed so long ago, was that small body generators were not too tough to get ahold of. The 12v regulator is easier than you might think; when my big black Bosch failed, I replaced it with a look-alike Delco unit from.... well, I forget what it was out of, but I found it in a catalog at my local auto electrical shop for a fraction of the price of the Bosch, which was unavailable anyway. For you, it will be a good excuse to replace the small fixed unit with one of the earlier, adjustable numbers.

I did my wipers with a 12v rheostat, but without looking at it, I suspect that your existing control will work fine on 12v., tho you may need a resistor to slow it down.

Remember, the voltage is greater, but the amps are less; this is why the stout wiring is never an issue with conversion.

Your electric tach will take some thought, and the temp gauge will need adjustment to work with a new sender, but the gas gauge simply doesn't care, one way or another.

I got around the temp gauge issue by replacing my speedo with the 12v. oil temp/press combo gauge out of an early 912 (w/chrome bezel).

While the beehives on my T-1 were no problem (after acquiring some of the tall lenses for all four tails (I also configured all to work as run/stop/turn for double the visibility) and the two front turns), your tear-drops will be a little trickier. The good 12v. bulbs are taller and hotter (of course) and may melt the lenses. There are smaller bulbs available, but they're not as bright as the good old 1156/7, but I've seen it worked out.

I believe that having native 12v. makes a big difference in the livability of the car. And as a bonus, cranking to fill the float bowls (if you do not take the chance for an easy elec. fuel pump installation) after sitting for a while, is faster and easier on the battery.

12v. is not everyone's cup 'o tea, but it has always suited me just fine.