Ignition timing....

Mick Cliff · Post by **Mick Cliff** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 7:54 am

Could someone advise the static timing setting for a 2.7RS and the setting with the engine running. What dwell angle should I be looking for?

Thanks in anticipation

Gary71 · Post by **Gary71** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:15 am

According to my manual:

Distributor Bosch 023 116 9011
Marelli 610 15 155
Points gap 0.35
Dwell angle Bosch 38 +/- 3deg
Marelli 37 +/- 3deg
Timing TDC @ 900 +/- 50rpm

But I'd trust Andy's data more than mine...

Mick Cliff · Post by **Mick Cliff** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 9:04 am

Thanks Gary

(points gap 0.35 - is that metric or imperial? I'd guess metric, thus giving a good old fashioned 14 thou [0.014"])

Mike · Post by **Mike** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:54 am

Hi Mick, thought you had gone all electronic

Mick Cliff · Post by **Mick Cliff** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 12:20 pm

Hi Mick, thought you had gone all electronic

Mike
Bit embarassing this.....
Spent Sunday afternoon installing the electronic kit (yeah, I know I've had it for 5 weeks or so) and the result was - I couldn't get the engine started! Messed about for the whole afternoon without any positive result - always saying to myself that it's something simple, stupid! Check, check and check again.....Nada! So back to square one and reinstalled the points, hence the need to get the points gap and timing right (I removed the distributor to fit the kit and 'lost' the timing!). So it now runs again - phew!
Busy at work this morning contemplating what I might have missed and the thought process goes...... +ve feed - check; points feed to new ignitor - check; timing, about right - check; think about the whole installation - check; thinks: how does the power get from the distributor to the spark plugs -

er, it needs to be routed via the rotor arm. Would probably have worked if I'd remembered to put the rotor back

Ah well, there's always next weekend - neighbours don't take too kindly to 107dB in the evenings

Mike · Post by **Mike** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 2:35 pm

hope it all works out, when you get round to sorting it. I still can't believe how smooth it made mine run, especially on tick over.

Gilbert '71 T · Post by **Gilbert '71 T** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 4:16 pm

Hi Mick,

I'm with Mike on this as well, I recently installed one on my car, and as Mike says I can't believe the difference it has made either, must say I have been very impressed so far, my car runs much better now, i still have popping on over run but I'm attributing that to either an air leak that I'll never bloody find or some other CIS related quirk. the whole process should take no longer than 20-30mins if you're methodical (or slow, like me

)

turn engine by hand until rotor points to no.1 cylinder, line in the dizzy and Z1 on crank pulley

pull distributor out, remove rotor & points

screw in the new module loosely in place of the points and run the wires out where the points pickup wire was.

install the magnetic ring over distributor cam (found it quite hard to get on all the way down the cam, but perseverance paid)

then set the gap between magnetic ring and module with the plastic spacer in the kit and tighten the module plate.

reinstall dizzy, remembering to point the rotor a bit behind/forward of the line on the dizzy depending on which rotation your dizzy has, as when the gear engages it moves slightly, ideally you want the rotor to be as near as dammit to the line in the dizzy at no1 cylinder when the dizzy is fully pushed in.

connect the black wire from the module to the points/cdi trigger wire (the one which used to attach to the dizzy)

connect the red wire to fuse number 3 on the fuse panel (make sure you have switched +12v at this fuse)

put the rotor back on (you might have to file part of the bottom off the rotor to get it to fit properly on the dizzy cam so that it's notch inside goes into the slot in the dizzy cam)

refit cap

start car (hopefully

)

set timing and never have to worry about those pesky points ever again

Hope it all works out next time, if it were me I'd have one more go, it might take you longer to get the points gap/dwell angle & timing dead on, especially if your dizzy cam is worn as mine was, but then i was aiming for 38 degree dwell angle on the button, as you can imagine... it was a test of patience

Hope this helps and once you've got it installed and the car running i hope you'll be as pleased with the results as Mike and I are

Gary71 · Post by **Gary71** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 6:02 pm

Or you could fit a HUGE wiring harness, ECU under the seat, various (say it quietly) Ford bits and ditch the distributor

Oh so simple....

Mick Cliff · Post by **Mick Cliff** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 7:25 pm

Darren
Did exactly as you have written, with one exception - forgot the rotor arm. Doh!
I reckon that after my 'experience' I could install the whole kit in 30mins

A couple of things though -
The mounting plate for the ignitor sits astride the mechanical/vacuum advance gubbins - is this right?
The tip about filing the bottom part of the rotor makes sense (so I must have tried to fit it at one stage - why did I leave it out

), as does ensuring that the magnetic ring is fully 'home'.

Gary - if only I had the b@lls

Gary71 · Post by **Gary71** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 7:44 pm

I had mine cut off.

Saves weight.

Mick Cliff · Post by **Mick Cliff** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 7:59 pm

I had mine cut off.

Saves weight.

Gilbert '71 T · Post by **Gilbert '71 T** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:04 pm

Mick Cliff wrote:Darren
Did exactly as you have written, with one exception - forgot the rotor arm. Doh!
I reckon that after my 'experience' I could install the whole kit in 30mins
A couple of things though -
The mounting plate for the ignitor sits astride the mechanical/vacuum advance gubbins - is this right?
The tip about filing the bottom part of the rotor makes sense (so I must have tried to fit it at one stage - why did I leave it out ), as does ensuring that the magnetic ring is fully 'home'.

Gary - if only I had the b@lls

Sorry Mick just fully read your post again, didnt see your minor oversight

we've all done equally daft things, not many of us are man enough to admit it though

Yes the mounting plate just sits in place of the points, it can really only be installed one way, looks kind of odd at first as the pickup point is about 90 degrees away from where the points used to open/close possibly more.

Another thing to check before you re-install the dizzy is have a suck on the vaccum advance pipe (ooh err missus) just to make sure the screw isnt binding on the points plate at all and to visually see if the vaccum advance is working nicely.

hope this helps & once again Good luck

Echo what you said to Gary as well, think it's great what he's done

Mick Cliff · Post by **Mick Cliff** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 11:22 pm

Second attempt....

Didn't even get as far as putting the distributor back in.
Convinced that the kit supplied is wrong. The mounting plate for the kit actually sits ON the mechanical advance and, as such, does not seat squarely on the baseplate in the distributor. Tightening down the mounting plate screw effectively locks the advance mechanism, rendering it immobile ('Proved' by sucking on the vacuum pipe, as suggested by Gilbert '71 T).
Taking the thing apart it looks like the mounting plate for the electronic 'bit' is a mirror image of what I think it should be.

FWIW the distributor is a Bosch 0231 184 004 (not 023 116 9011 as stated by Gary71) and rotates clockwise.

After reinstalling the points (again!) and carefully setting up the timing (again!) I found that the car runs better than before. Experimenting with the points gap I found that at .012" gap there was a definate 'stumble' on pick up. Increasing the gap to .015" eliminated the 'stumble' and the tickover speed increased from ~900rpm to ~1300rpm. In both cases the timing was checked as ~TDC at ~900rpm.

All-in-all it took 30mins to get the electronic kit ready to install, 10 mins to revert to points and 3 hours to fcuk about with the points/gap/timing.

Looks like copying Gary's Megasquirt installation might be easier to sort than this?

One really bizarre piece of knowledge - with the twin RSR-type exhaust, messing with the points gap/timing whilst kneeling at the rear of the car is NOT recommended - the

Gary71 · Post by **Gary71** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 11:46 pm

..the

gas made you pass out half way through writing the post...

Gilbert '71 T · Post by **Gilbert '71 T** » Sun Oct 15, 2006 1:42 am

Gary71 wrote:..the

gas made you pass out half way through writing the post...

Blimey Mick you're not having much luck with this

if the mounting plate appears to be a mirror image then i think that's actually right (i.e. the gap adjustment is on the opposite end of where the points would normally adjust if i recall correctly) I've also got a 0231-184 series dizzy in my car, which i think are all clockwise, and the kit I got had a part number 1867 is this what you have? if not you might have the wrong kit.

I have a spare one in the car I can get a picture of it tomorrow for you to see if it's the same as you have? I'll also try to get you a picture of the pickup unit installed in my dizzy, it might shed some light

I feel your pain setting up the points, even with a dwell meter it can still be a right pain in the arse