My engine won't come out

[PeterK]

Well, I followed the Bentley bible to remove engine and box from my 1979 SC intending to cure the Torrey Canyon effect from the top of the engine (and as part of my forthcoming sills, b-posts, kidneys & general respray and targa seals exercise). Had a major pig getting the small grub screw out of the shift linkage - naturally it was all rounded out, so having failed on all other creative attempts, I finally admitted defeat and reached for the drill & dremel. So grub screw dealt with, I just need to buy a helicoil now. Rear ARB / sway bar came off - just two sheared bolts to drill out (of 4). Finally got foxed when I found all of the CV hex socket head bolts were rounded off inside.

So, my masterful Plan B was to remove engine on its own and then sit in the engine bay to getter better access to the CV bolts and then pull the gearbox. Using Dempsey's 101 projects book, I double and triple checked for everything that should be off & disconnected. It took three hours to get to here, yet a further 3 hours later, I've not progressed any further. I've pulled, shaken, sworn & begged, but the engine won't shift even 10mm along the 4 studs to the gearbox. I've slowly raised the engine bit by bit & repeated, then lowered the engine bit by bit & repeated. And again and again, and again. It is just sitting there, laughing in my face . I was shaking the engine so much I was at risk of shaking the car off the axle stands.

So, oh collective oracle of usefulness, I come to prostrate myself in front of you and ask for guidance. What have I missed, where's the hidden bolt or what's the magic trick here please ???????

[redrobin911]

Are you just removing the engine or the engine and gearbox? Different procedure and IMO better to take both out at the same time. If that what your doing the gearlinkage shaft that goes into the tunnel needs to come past the body work before you can lower everything.

[PeterK]

I wanted to remove engine & box, but as I can't get the CV bolts out (all rounded off), I'm now trying to separate the engine and gearbox to remove the engine on it's own first. That's where I'm stuck

[redrobin911]

The CV bolts at the engine side I assume - these are 8mm(?) from memory Allen head - strange that they're rounded off inside? It's not easy to help when your not there, any other local DDK'ers near you who could help?

[PeterK]

It seems that one of the previous owners, or their local 'expert' was a gentle soul. It took a 3foot long bar to get enough leverage to undo the sump plug from the oil tank , so I'm not too surprised that allen socket headed bolts are less than perfect.
Peter

[Berny]

Use a long dot punch or chisel to loosen the cv bolts to the gear box refit some bolts to hold the engine/box together and take it out as a unit! given time and a few bashed fingers you will get there in the end.

[fetuhoe]

Its just not coming out with the transmission bolted in place.

It may come out if you unbolt the transmission crossmember and manage to get them at a sufficiently steep angle top slide them apart but that could be a tricky.

If the heads on the bolts are rounded on all the CVs the only real way is to try to knock them round with a chisel.

Can you undo the CV at the trailing arm hub end? as the plunge will allow the shafts to come out with the transmission.

You could try an Irwin grip set as they will garb hold of rounded bolts and I have seen them undo rounded out cap heads.

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/5-piece-bolt-grip-set/

if you get really stuck you could drop the trailing arms as well.

[butzsi]

Forgive me for suggesting the obvious (if that is the case).

Have you removed the clutch omega spring arm and the short clutch operating lever completely , and the starter motor ? Have you removed the auxiliary air pump and it's holding bracket completely?

If you have then it seems likely that the balance point of the engine (where you have supported with jack) is causing the engine to tip and bind on the studs or ring gear teeth. When the engine and gearbox are say 8mm apart is the line between crankcase edge and bellhousing parallel or at an angle?

Chris

[PeterK]

Thanks for all of the suggestions folks.

I like obvious - obvious is normally the culprit. I have no aux air pump, but the clutch mini lever and little spring, plus circlip and longer lever with monster round spring are removed, but not the starter motor, where I've just disconnected the cables - is this OK ?. Between engine and gearbox I have removed 3 normal nuts & washers and the 10mm barrel nut. Just as a thought - is there more than 1 barrel nut up there ?

I am using the drain plug / strainer panel as my jacking support. The gap at the top of the engine is less than that at the bottom, so I tried the engine both high and low. How low can I go ? - should the engine fan be below the rear bumper when I pull ?. I've removed the shift linkage 'bit', but am worried that the shaft from the gearbox is pressing on the top of the 'hole' it passes through.
Peter

[butzsi]

Thanks for all of the suggestions folks.

I like obvious - obvious is normally the culprit. I have no aux air pump, but the clutch mini lever and little spring, plus circlip and longer lever with monster round spring are removed, but not the starter motor, where I've just disconnected the cables - is this OK ?. Between engine and gearbox I have removed 3 normal nuts & washers and the 10mm barrel nut. Just as a thought - is there more than 1 barrel nut up there ?

I am using the drain plug / strainer panel as my jacking support. The gap at the top of the engine is less than that at the bottom, so I tried the engine both high and low. How low can I go ? - should the engine fan be below the rear bumper when I pull ?. I've removed the shift linkage 'bit', but am worried that the shaft from the gearbox is pressing on the top of the 'hole' it passes through.
Peter

Removal of all 4 bellhousing fasteners is fine - starter can stay on providing it is the upper barrel nut that you have removed and not the lower one near the cv joint.

The angle between the engine and box is the clue, the engine needs to be low enough for the fan housing to clear the rear box section but at the same time the joint faces eng/gbox need to be parallel to pull the engine out. You may find that you either need to support the gearbox to enable the engine to drop low enough without bending the gearbox selector shaft or remove as many of the 10mm studs to achieve this angle (starting with the upper starter stud) as required.

Chris

[Ian Comerford]

Is it worth going back and having one more go at the cv joints but this time try using a set of Stillsons (pipe wrench) on the outside of the bolt head?

Ian

[sladey]

Don't shoot me down for this one But are the CV joint bolts are those 12 pointed (I think it's 12 anyway) star things?

Just a thought that if they've got crud in them you might think they are hex bolts. Again this might be different on the earlier cars (or you might have later bolts fitted) but on my 80s one it's those multi pointed cap headed bolts

Might be stupid but worth asking the stupid questions at this stage

EDIT:- I appear to be talking complete shite here - just looked online for pictures to support my assertion and they generally appear to be hex. I was convinced they were multi-star things - must be getting old. Sorry to waste your time

[PeterK]

No worries Sladey - in my despair I did actually try Torx 'cos I couldn't believe that all of the heads had been rounded, but no joy.

Ian - I'll tried Mole grips, but they just slipped. I'l try small Stillsons, but not hopefull. If the gentle soul has managed to round the hex head sockets, then I'm guessing that an air tool or similar has been used, and the bolts are well tight.
Peter

[Bruce M]

There's mole grips and then there's mole grips. You need good quality items with sharp hard teeth.

In past I've sorted this issue by drilling the head off the bolts and once the CV is out of the way it is fairly easy to undo the left over stump as the tension is gone. HOWEVER, that is no good unless you can pull the cv off the end of the bolts which might be impossible in your situation.

[PeterK]

Thanks Bruce - that's my nuclear option - no coming back from there