Okrasa Special

Bruce M · Post by **Bruce M** » Sun May 08, 2011 10:19 pm

There is a fine line between committed and committed.

But then again Barry doesn't strike me as being easy-ozie with the fine details.

Btw. That bus is a great colour. Really sets of the tan/wood interior. Looks like the quality of bus Ron Brown would find in some dusty barn.

steve wright · Post by **steve wright** » Wed May 11, 2011 7:22 am

Hi Bruce, glad you like the bus, she is a pretty rare specimen as they only exported RHD westfalias to Australia and SA, and not the UK which seems odd. Planning on fitting a tow bar and using it to haul the Special with it. I can't see myself sleeping in the Special if we race the thing!

louis356 · Post by **louis356** » Wed May 11, 2011 2:18 pm

This guy is using the same principals to create his handmade body.

I must say he did his alot quicker than you guys are going.

He built the base chassis, engine AND bodywork

Pull your fingers out guys!!!

http://thelawl.com/funny/homemade-porsche-car/

steve wright · Post by **steve wright** » Wed May 11, 2011 2:50 pm

mate, we were at that stage months ago and ours runs on the internal combustion engine, none of this silly lycra-clad, sweaty human stuff

Barry · Post by **Barry** » Wed May 11, 2011 4:56 pm

louis356 wrote:This guy is using the same principals to create his handmade body.

I must say he did his alot quicker than you guys are going.

He built the base chassis, engine AND bodywork

Pull your fingers out guys!!!

http://thelawl.com/funny/homemade-porsche-car/

They did have the advantage of knowing what shape they were working to

On the other hand, it would be obvious if it was 'wrong' whereas we can pretty much do whatever we fancy, just as long as it looks 'good' whatever that might mean to whomever.

An amazing project, and one that Steve and I have viewed before. We did wonder what the back-story is, as the premises they are in look very slick.

Great stuff, and ingenious use of the pipe as well

.

Been frantic this week, so not had a chance to put up any pics, not that there was anything very exciting picture wise (not very photogenic subject this week), but very useful progress nevertheless, and I think we're though our sticky period on the rear. By the end of the next session, the revised wireform and hammerform should be finished.

I'll pop up the pics at some point this week ....

Barry · Post by **Barry** » Wed May 11, 2011 11:17 pm

Before I start, I must correct something.

Steve might have overstated my dedication to the project somewhat. On my last note I said that awoke at 2:30am to realise that I hadn't covered some sharp ends of cut wire(form), and had returned at 10:00am sunday morning to correct this. Due to my terrible writing no doubt, he took this to mean that I had infact rushed back up in the wee hours (in my nightgown, clutching a candle in one hand, and teddy-bear in the other), but I hadn't.

I'm really quite dedicated, but 2:30am, on a sunday?

Anyway, back to the task in hand.

First job was to remove the trial skin, and then the paper:

This did highlight something interesting, and that was that stripped out, the wireform looked great again. It really illustrates that the nearer you can get to the final finish for assessment, the better.

I think what a large part of it is, is that your eye goes straight to the outside perimeter of the tail, whereas when skinned, the eye goes to the inner edge of the kamm, i.e. it looks at the flat area. Well, just a thought anyway.

Next job was to alter hammerform number two. First make cardboard template from sketch on car, transfer to MDF for tweaking to get curves to flow, and finally, move over to hammerform for cutting:

Using the up-turned, revised, hammerform, the new perimeter wire could be laid out. It has to be formed bit by bit by hand, using the vice, and overlaid onto the form. All of the inner wires are purely there to hold the outer shape, and once the thing is firmly in the car, can be removed. Therefore the lower, horizontal, bar doesn't represent anything.

When I offered up this new tail, it became evident that actually, the orginal one was offset be quite a way. In retrospect this was because when that one went on, I just was keen to throw 'anything' on as a starter, and the whole thing happened very quickly. Of course then it turned out that we both liked the look of it, and it stayed.

Anyway, in off-setting the orginal, it meant that actually, it would have needed to be about 1 1/2 inches wider anyway, just to get the same inset from each tyre. This meant that even the revised (wider) tail needed to be still wider again. In turn this meant cutting the MKII hammerform (revised), and stretching it, and then in turn, the rear wirework.

Initially I tried 3 3/4 inches wider (which would have meant that our new tail would be around 5 1/2 inches bigger at it's widest then the orginal). This then looked a bit too wide (the first time on this project, so actually quite a good marker), so I then re-adjusted the form, re-cut the wire (again) removed the 3 3/4 inches, put in 2 inches, and that was that:

And then using the rims and the trailing arms as guides (this time

), welded in the wire kamm:

Next job is to tidy up the wire on the offside (won't put any new on the nearside, as that will be in MDF if the shape works O.K.), and then revise slightly the shape of the rear wing. As where it's now heading has changed somewhat, it needs a tweak ahead of, and behind, the wheel, as well as the more obvious rearward area.

Then it'll be a case of sorting out the valance area, and how that blends into the lower rear wing, plus of course, re-doing / repairing / re-making the rear hammerform once and foreall.

Interestingly, having totted up 'hours on tools' just now, so far I've got just about 200 hours in the project. That doesn't include research on 'tinternet, chatting on phone, or meeting up at the workshop to discuss. Even so, I was surprised that it wasn't more, although I suspect that there's another 40-65 hours to go before phase one is completely complete, so to speak.

I think one advantage we have in working this way (one day a week), is that actually most of the time our problem solving has been done in 'non-workshop' time, so that on the whole, the time I do spend up there is actually quite productive. I would suspect that (for this phase at least), if I had been there full time, I'd have been waiting for feedback / ideas as time ticked by. As it is, by and large, as soon as we run out of ideas, the clock has stopped, thinking started, solution / idea to try has arisen, and the clock re-starts.

Barry · Post by **Barry** » Wed May 11, 2011 11:30 pm

Oh yes, note the new, more agressive tilt to the tail. The wire represents the outer lip, so the actual flat part of the panel will be a good deal more vertical.

I tried to find a middle ground of having a definite tilt, and getting the flat part of the kamm away from being dead-vertical, without going too OTT for the type of car.

As it sits, the new higher crown of the 'bootlid' running into the rear edge of the rear wing looks very encouraging. In fact, rather like the front end, having had all of this angst with this area, it's now becoming one of my favourite parts of the car.

Trouble is, I'm now looking at the the middle with some suspicion. We're going to carry out a very quick experiment with some ally, with the possibility of adding some more shape (weight) about half way down the front-rear line of the centre of the car. I've always felt that there was a very slight issue with the front wings looking a tiny bit gaunt just behind the wheel.

Anyway, I don't think it will take much to try (nothing compared to the re-modelling that has gone on with the front and rear), and it won't affect existing jig work much, if at all.

BAHumbug · Post by **BAHumbug** » Thu May 12, 2011 5:10 am

Wowsa!!!
Spot on Barry!
Even from here I can see both your talent and why Steve was after you to do the metallurgy on his project.
It's fantastic.

Barry · Post by **Barry** » Thu May 12, 2011 2:21 pm

Thank you Bruce, that's a very cheeering comment

. Now if I can just get my big fat head through these double doors ....

Again, apologies for the rather un-inspiring pictures this week: really, really can't wait to get back up there. Mojo fully restored, and I love it when I can see where we're heading, and the shape starts to emerge. It's very much one of those things where you suddenly realise, 'blimey, we're really building a car'. It's like being a kid again, but the playroom's bigger, and the tools aren't made by Tomy.

Well, mine aren't. What about yours Steve?

steve wright · Post by **steve wright** » Fri May 13, 2011 9:06 am

yes, yes, I need to go out and buy some proper tools

rather than dicking around with the plastic tonka-toy ones I bought on a whim. At least it provides you and Ian with an endless opportunity for enjoyment and ridicule at the moment

Barry · Post by **Barry** » Fri May 13, 2011 2:31 pm

That is very true.

Looking forward to having a good session with the car this weekend

.

steve wright · Post by **steve wright** » Fri May 13, 2011 5:52 pm

Ooh err missus, sounds almost like an illicit liason Barry

Barry · Post by **Barry** » Fri May 13, 2011 10:48 pm

Good point, I could have worded that better

.

Barry · Post by **Barry** » Sun May 15, 2011 7:22 pm

Well another teeny tiny step forward this weekend.

The first job to do was wheel the dummy bootlid to get an idea of just how much shape would start to look right.

From last week (or whenever it was), there was already quite a bit of shape* in the panel, but even so, it still looked dead flat. BTW it seems to be the convention that in order for any panel to look flat on a car, it needs a bit of shape anyway, otherwise it'll tend to look as though it's imploding.

Up to now, I've been attempting to wheel the bootlid (lets forget the '' '' for now

) on my own. I had been advised that the biggest shape one person can wheel on their own is 3ft square. Well, this must be a little shorter one way, a little longer the other. They were right: it is down-right impossible to wheel a piece this big on your own.

The trouble is that you can only hold the panel in two places (what with only having two hands / arms an all), and the metal hangs down whever you can't hold it. Two things then happen: the top wheel digs into the panel, forming grooves (I'm going to tell Steve they are 'multiple feature lines', and highly desirable), and because it's hanging down so much, it actually takes up something of a set, rather than lying flat.

Anyway, as it takes more shape and stiffens, it becomes much easier to control, and as it happens Steve arrived and got on the other side of the panel. I have to say that he was an excellent wheeling partner, and it worked very well. Steve's first bit of wheeling, and my first bit of two-man wheeling. I think if we were starting that panel again (which we will of course, this is only a tester), we should have quite a good chance with it.

We added a surprising amount of shape before it started to look right, but we're there now it seems. The rule shows just how much has been wheeled in, especially when you think of the curve going from left to right.

Barry · Post by **Barry** » Sun May 15, 2011 7:29 pm

*Shape

Shape is different to curve or a bend. A curve or bend can be formed in a flat sheet (like a sheet of paper), whereas shape is two dimensional, i.e. it is a curve in both planes. The more shape, the more pronounced the 'hump'. Also referred to as crown: high crown, lotta shape, low crown nottalotta shape.

The bigger the panel and the lower the crown, the harder it is to wheel. Therefore beginners try to start with the highest crown and smallest panels they can, and graduate towards the larger, lower crown panels later on.

We'll do the same thing, probably start with wings, anything hammerformed, outer sills, then rear quarters (behind doors), doors, then the bootlid, and finally the bonnet centre section. I'll almost certainly call in a coachbuilding chum for that one, depending on how we get on.