Tyre recommendations

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IanM
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by IanM »

5.2.3. Tyres
You only need to inspect the tyres fitted to the road wheels at the time of the inspection. If you notice a defect on a spare tyre, you should advise the vehicle presenter.

Size
The aspect ratio of a tyre is included in the size marking. For example, a 215/55R15 has an aspect ratio of 55%.

‘Standard’ car tyres have a nominal aspect ratio of 82% (unless marked otherwise) and these are almost identical in size to tyres with an aspect ratio of 80%. They can be safely mixed in any configuration on a vehicle.

Some tyres may be marked with two sizes. For example, a 185/75R14 tyre may be dual marked 185R14. In such cases, you can accept either marking.

Load rating - Classes 5 and 7 only
A tyre load rating table is in Appendix B.

Make sure the tyre load rating is suitable for the axle weight.

You can find the permitted maximum laden weight of an axle on the manufacturer’s plate.

If axle weights are not displayed on the manufacturer’s plate, you must assume that the load capacity of the tyres are suitable, unless there’s indisputable evidence to suggest otherwise.

If a goods vehicle has a ‘Ministry’ plate showing lower axle weights not to be exceeded in Great Britain, you must use those instead of the ones on the manufacturer’s plate.

Speed rating - Classes 5 and 7 only
A tyre’s speed rating is shown on the sidewall as a letter and usually precedes or follows the load rating. Speed ratings from A to K are unacceptable, with the exception of H.

If no speed rating is shown it must be assumed that the minimum requirements are met.

Load ratings for low speed rated tyres - Class 5 vehicles only
Tyres must be suitable for use up to 70mph (L speed rating) unless the vehicle is a ‘restricted speed vehicle’.

If the tyre can carry the maximum permitted axle weight of the vehicle, these vehicles can use tyres with a lower speed rating tyres up to 70mph as follows:

K speed rating – but the tyre’s carrying capacity is reduced by 3%
J speed rating – but the tyre’s carrying capacity is reduced by 7%
For example, K speed rating tyres can be used at 70mph if the load is reduced as follows: 146/143K = 6,000kg single or 10,900kg dual - less 3% = 5,820kg single or 10,580kg dual

You must not accept a tyre load rating that’s less than the maximum permitted axle weight.

Structure
Tyres of different types of structure, such as radial-ply and cross-ply, must not be mixed on the same axle.
Steel and fabric radial-ply tyres are considered to be the same structure.

Run flat and conventional tyres can be mixed on the same axle, although this is not recommended.

Condition and fitment
Evidence of a tyre contacting a part of the vehicle, such as due to tyre flexing or suspension movement, is not considered to be a defect. A vehicle should only be rejected if the tyre is fouling a part of the vehicle at the time of test.

Some vehicles have lock stops comprising rubbing pads on the body that the front tyres may contact on a full lock. These are acceptable if they are properly maintained so that they do not damage the tyres.

When assessing cuts in a tyre, it is permissible to check whether a cut is deep enough to reach the ply or cord by using a blunt instrument to open the cut taking care not to cause further damage.

The following criteria should be used when assessing a cut in a tyre:

any ply or cord that can be seen without touching the tyre - fail
if by folding back rubber or opening a cut with a blunt instrument, so as not to cause further damage, exposed ply or cord can be seen irrespective of the size of the cut - fail
if a cut which is more than 25mm or 10% of the section width whichever is the greater, is opened with a blunt instrument and cords can be felt but not seen - fail
Before failing a cut, you must make sure it’s the cords that you can feel not a foreign object. If you’re not sure, then you should pass and advise.

When assessing lumps or bulges in a radial ply tyre, care should be taken to distinguish between normal undulations in the carcass, resulting from manufacturing, and lumps or bulges caused by structural deterioration.

Take extra care with stretched tyres because they’re more prone to sidewall damage.

Recut tyres are only permitted on:

vehicles over 3,050kg ULW
goods vehicles with an ULW of at least 2,540kg having at least 16 inch (405mm) diameter wheels
passenger vehicles with an ULW of at least 2,540kg having 8 or more passenger seats
You should only accept tyres with NHS, Not for Highway Use or similar markings if they have an ‘E’ marking and a number contained within a circle. Adjacent to this circle, the sidewall must also be marked with a six digit number, which may be preceded by 75R or similar marking (see example below).

Example tyre marking

Direction of rotation may be indicated by an arrow and/or words, but an arrow by itself should not be taken to indicate direction of rotation.

Asymmetric tyres are marked with correct fitment information on the sidewall, such as ‘outside’. However, if an asymmetric tyre is fitted the wrong way around it is not to be considered a reason for rejection. The presenter should be advised.

Tread depth
A tread pattern is the combination of plain surfaces and grooves extending across the breadth of the tread and round the entire circumference. It excludes any tie-bars, tread wear indicators, or features designed to wear out substantially before the remainder of the pattern, and other minor features.

In simple terms, grooves containing tread wear indicators (TWI) or grooves cut as deep as those containing the wear indicators when new, are considered to be primary grooves. Other grooves or sipes that are not cut as deep as the primary grooves are secondary grooves and are not to be considered when assessing tread depth.

The ‘breadth of tread’ is the part of the tyre which can contact the road under normal conditions of use measured at 90 degrees to the peripheral line of the tread.

Different vehicles require different tread depths.

The following vehicles first used on or after 3 January 1933 need 1.6mm tread depth:

passenger vehicles with a maximum of 8 passenger seats, excluding the driver’s seat
goods vehicles or dual-purpose vehicles not exceeding 3,500kg DGW
tricycles with an ULW more than 410kg and all quadricycles
The primary grooves of the tread pattern must be at least 1.6mm deep within the central three-quarters of the breadth of tread and around the entire outer circumference of the tyre (see diagram 1).

Either side of the central three-quarters of the tyre can be devoid of tread (‘bald’).

Diagram 1. Primary and secondary grooves in tyre tread pattern

""

The following vehicles must have 1.0mm tread depth:

vehicles first used before 3 January 1933
passenger vehicles with more than 8 passenger seats excluding the driver’s seat
tricycles with an ULW not exceeding 410kg with an engine capacity greater than 50cc
tricycles with an ULW not exceeding 410kg which are electrically powered
The tread pattern must be visible over the whole tread area (see diagram 2), and have a depth of at least 1.0mm throughout a single band of at least three-quarters over any section of the breadth of tread round the entire outer circumference of the tyre.

The 1.0mm tread depth requirement applies to the whole tread width if the original tread pattern did not extend beyond three-quarters of the tyre width when new.

Tricycles with an ULW not exceeding 410kg with an engine capacity not greater than 50cc do not need to have 1mm of tread. However, they must have a visible tread pattern around the entire circumference and across the whole breadth of the tread.

Diagram 2. Tread pattern visibility

""

Tyre age
The check of tyre age applies to all vehicles with more than 8 passenger seats, other than vehicles of historical interest.

Tyre age is determined by the date code on the sidewall and will be a three or four-digit code. Tyres with a three-digit code will be more than 10 years old.

The code is usually located in a ‘window’ on the sidewall and may or may not be located at the end of the DOT number (see image below).

example image of a date code on a tyre sidewall

The first two digits of the code represent the week of manufacture of the tyre and the second two digits represent the year of manufacture. In the example above, the tyre was manufactured in week 35 of 2016.

Tyres over ten years old at the time of test must be failed if they are on:

any front steered axle
any rear axle of a minibus with a single wheel fitment.
Tyres not displaying a date code must also be failed. However, date codes are only required to be marked on one side of the tyre so it may not be possible to see the date code on twin wheel fitments. Under these circumstances you should advise the presenter and assume the date code is present and the tyre age is acceptable.

On tyres where the date code is illegible, for example, due to kerbing or deliberate tampering, a major or minor defect must be recorded, depending on the location of the tyre.

Retreaded tyres
Remoulded/retreaded tyres may have two date codes. One being the original code and the other being the date of retreading. In this case the most recent date code must be used.

example image of a date code on a remoulded tyre

The appearance of the date code on retreaded tyres may be different from the original date code and may be branded rather than moulded.
Good news indeed.
  • If I understand correctly, an early 911 is neither Class 5 nor Class 7
    No mention of E marking
    Tyres of different types of structure, such as radial-ply and cross-ply, must not be mixed on the same axle
So, it means the Dunlop L and M sections, which are cross-plys, are perfectly legal for public roads in the UK.

.
Lightweight_911
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by Lightweight_911 »

.

I've driven a few cars fitted with Dunlop CR65 tyres on public roads - which I'm fairly sure are NOT road legal - & the road handling was 'scary' at times since they require getting some heat in them to perform well.

I'd also be concerned about an insurance company using this as a 'get-out clause' in the case of a claim ...

.
Andy

“Adding power makes you faster on the straights;
- subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere”
Lightweight_911
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by Lightweight_911 »

.

As far as I remember, the only 'road legal' racing tyres are certain 16" (& above) which were specifically developed by Dunlop for older cars driving to/from events ... & those tyres are E-marked .

.
Andy

“Adding power makes you faster on the straights;
- subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere”
Dougal Cawley
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by Dougal Cawley »

I think when it says that on the side wall you are bolloxed aren't you. I'd like to see some arguing, it wasn't there fault, to the insurance company from their hospital bed when you have that slapped on the side wall.
For Racing Purposes only - Not For highway Use small.jpg
if you cant see it very well on a small screen or something it says: "For Racing Purposes only - Not For highway Use"

the Dunlop Racing L and M section tyres have that on the side wall, as do all 15" Dunlop Racing tyres.

The 16" Dunlop Racing R5 are actually road legal. However they are the wrong size for all Porsche. Early 365 and 550 Spyder did fit 16" wheels, but Dunlop dont make a Racing tyre the right size.

The good news is that Pirelli now do! they have made a 500/525-16 Stella bianca the perfect period tyre.

https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/pirell ... ianca.html

Its kind of great news, but not for many people.
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IanM
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by IanM »

Dougal Cawley wrote: Fri Nov 29, 2024 11:59 am
slapped on the side wall.

"For Racing Purposes only - Not For highway Use"

the Dunlop Racing L and M section tyres have that on the side wall, as do all 15" Dunlop Racing tyres.
I didn't know that. Thanks for the heads-up. It's a pity really.

Made in Portugal? Is it made by the same company (Nova Motorsport) who bought Avon recently?
https://www.racecar-engineering.com/art ... -portugal/

Did earlier Dunlop race tyres (pre-Portugal, made in the UK) have that lettering on the sidewall?

p.s.
I find it hard to believe that 'remoulded' tyres are legal in the UK if Dunlop CR65's are not. LOL
Nine One One
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by Nine One One »

IanM wrote: Fri Nov 29, 2024 3:00 pm
p.s.
I find it hard to believe that 'remoulded' tyres are legal in the UK if Dunlop CR65's are not. LOL
Never look at a UK bus or truck then..........over 50% of them use remoulded tyres, and the only time they have ‘new’ tyres fitted is when they are purchased as a new vehicle.
911hillclimber
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by 911hillclimber »

I used several sets of AVON CR28 Sport tyres on my 911 when i drove it on the road to compete on the hills and back on the road home. (205 x 15 x 50)
Did that for 14 years.
They were great tyres imho, ran true and when 1/2 worn really worked well even in the rain.
Tried a set of TOYO somethings which were awful and led to a crash at Shelsley Walsh, but operator error was largely to blame....

The CR28's were taken off the MSA road class listing which was a great shame.
73T 911 Coupe, road/hillclimber 3.2L
Lola t 492 / 3.2 hillclimb racer
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IanM
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by IanM »

Lightweight_911 wrote: Fri Nov 29, 2024 9:10 am .
& those tyres are E-marked .
.
E-marking is not a requirement in the UK according to the MOT Manual.
I'd also be concerned about an insurance company using this as a 'get-out clause' in the case of a claim ...
Good point.
"For Racing Purposes only - Not For highway Use"
Does that statement count in every country in the world? I doubt it. I think that is an EU thing, for tyres without E-mark. I think it doesn't count in the UK anymore. CR65's are street legal in USA as I have seen some guys using them.
Nine One One
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by Nine One One »

Long winded old thread.............but nothing has changed really
https://police.community/topic/294181-d ... oad-legal/

If a manufacturer puts 'not for highway use’ or ‘competition use only’ then basically you are on a hiding if the car gets involved in an incident on a UK public road.

From Motorsport UK website.............
https://www.motorsportuk.org/wp-content ... yres-L.pdf
911hillclimber
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by 911hillclimber »

A old friend built a road spec Y type Ford Hot Rod in early 1971 and used AVON race tyres fo the 10" wide rear rims. 'Not for Highway Use' or 'Racing only' were moulded into the side walls, or were..
Some burnished those words off the outer wall even back then.
Or just didn't bother.
Was the 70's after all.
Many racing tyre compounds are too soft for road use.

My hillclimb tyres last about 100 miles on track.
73T 911 Coupe, road/hillclimber 3.2L
Lola t 492 / 3.2 hillclimb racer
Boxster 987 Gen II 2.9
IanM
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by IanM »

911hillclimber wrote: Sun Dec 01, 2024 9:48 am My hillclimb tyres last about 100 miles on track.
So, that's probably why. Just not enough miles.
Dougal Cawley
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by Dougal Cawley »

911hillclimber wrote: Fri Nov 29, 2024 4:36 pm I used several sets of AVON CR28 Sport tyres on my 911 when i drove it on the road to compete on the hills and back on the road home. (205 x 15 x 50)
Did that for 14 years.
They were great tyres imho, ran true and when 1/2 worn really worked well even in the rain.
Tried a set of TOYO somethings which were awful and led to a crash at Shelsley Walsh, but operator error was largely to blame....

The CR28's were taken off the MSA road class listing which was a great shame.
Have you tried these?

https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/catalo ... gory/6437/

What time are you getting up Shelseley in? I managed to throw this bad boy up there in 38.5
137330648_3790044681062214_1282110954025797192_o.jpg
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911hillclimber
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by 911hillclimber »

Don't hillclimb the old 911 anymore, retired it about 14 years ago!
The tyre choice then was the grippy KUMHO V70 soft tyre which were really good wet or dry and lasted about 1 year/ 3000 miles. Used them on my hot Impreza.
E marked tyre, now off the List 1B MS uk regs which is a shame, and just £120 each at the time.

I think my Impeza times are around 35 secs, long time ago now.

The Lola on AVON crossply/ 13" A28 spec is around 31 secs.
73T 911 Coupe, road/hillclimber 3.2L
Lola t 492 / 3.2 hillclimb racer
Boxster 987 Gen II 2.9
Dougal Cawley
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by Dougal Cawley »

Wow! 31 seconds sounds terrifying.

Are you flat out up to the Esses? I am but it is pretty terifying. i can't do it until my second or 3rd run.
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911hillclimber
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Re: Tyre recommendations

Post by 911hillclimber »

Yes, as quick as my nerves take me unless wet and on dry slicks then really hard going.

One day maybe might cut a 29 but that will be a challenge at 72 years old...

Braving botton Esse is a pain, and having bent my 911 in top esse I always swear going through there...

Image
73T 911 Coupe, road/hillclimber 3.2L
Lola t 492 / 3.2 hillclimb racer
Boxster 987 Gen II 2.9
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