DDK - Die Deutschen Klassiker

Hello,

Is anyone in Scotland able to find Ethanol free fuel? Alternatively does anyone know of a reasonable supplier to deliever a barrel (200Litres)? I have priced Classic Fuels, but at ~£600/bbl it is hard to justify when I don't need leaded fuel; I just don't want the Ethanol.

Thanks Chris

According to Esso their synergy supreme + ethanol free unleaded petrol is only available at selected stations and non of them are in Scotland. I assume the other companies will be the same.

Regards
Mike

I have just pulled this off the Esso website: The majority of unleaded 95 Octane petrol sold in the UK contains up to 5% ethanol as required under the Government’s Renewable Transport Fuels Obligation (RTFO).

There is currently no requirement for renewable fuel (such as ethanol) to be present in super unleaded (97 grade petrol).

Esso super unleaded petrol (Synergy Supreme+ Unleaded 97) is ethanol free (except in Devon, Cornwall, the Teesside area and Scotland). We would therefore advise anyone who has concerns about the presence of ethanol in petrol to use Synergy Supreme+ – providing they do not fill up in Devon or Cornwall, the Teesside area or Scotland.

Our Synergy Fuels:
• Diesel
• Supreme+ Diesel
• Unleaded
• Supreme+ Unleaded

However according to the label on the pumps at my local Esso station in Shrewsbury the Synergy Supreme+ contained 5% Ethanol. The fuel will be supplied from the refinery at Queensferry on the Wirral (I think) and will supply a very large area of the North West.

A new mission is to find Ethanol free Synergy Supreme+ but I probably don’t travel far enough in the Targa these days to breakout into an Ethanol free zone.

John

I know ethanol seems to cause us a problems with our fuel pipes but why does it not cause problems for all cars?
Do they somehow manage to avoid having any flexible pipes in the system or do they use a different type of pipe?
If so why can't we do so?
Some pipes I see are wrapped in some sort of metal but I presume that they are the same underneath and then how does one know that they are failing?

Ethanol is an issue for us old car owners. I think this article from Hagerty is informative.

https://www.hagerty.co.uk/articles/ever ... ews_Weekly

It does includes some information about Ethanol stabilisers/ neutraliser - not a route I would choose to go down at the moment whilst we are at 5% Ethanol.

John

The key phrase here is upto 5%. You won't find a super unleaded pump without that E5 marker. It's the law for them to be displayed.

However it doesn't mean that the fuel contains 5% Ethanol. Just upto.

Ethanol can be extracted as it's hygroscopic.

But then be warned, Ethanol has anti knock properties and raises the octave level of the fuel. Remove the Ethanol, lower the octane rating. It has it's benefits and it's here to stay.

Ethanol has the effect of leaning out the fuel mixture so run your carbs a little bit richer. Modern fuels are just so much more volatile than classic fuel, this is where the hot start and stale fuel issues arise.

Isn't this a case of avoid regular unleaded where possible and do some preventative maintenance? I had the fuel lines changed on my car recently and plan to do so regularly. There seems to be a few other key areas affected which can also be dealt with so using 95 is more acceptable.

Anyone know what the main affected areas are on old 911s?

I just use super or v-power all the time ( all have ethanol in them round here ) . I keep an eye on the engine bay fuel lines on every start up in the 2.4 . Ethanol effects rubber .. so in theory the fuel pump seals caan be effected ... beyond that we should be ok

964 I use vpower to , but rightly or wrongly dont check the fuel lines etc regularly

V Power for my old 911 and it's predecessors before it for 30 years.
Never changed a hose in that time, and most are from a 1986 car.

Have run the Lola race car with Halford's best carb hoses and all's well for 8 years.

Not a difficult task to change all hoses on a routine (every 3 to 5 years?) for peace of mind, but this is a big topic in classic car circles, from Morris Minor to 911 so someone must make a resistant hose by now?

There doesn’t appear to be anyone in UK supplying a full kit of ethanol resistant lines apart from Porsche. I’ve just bought a full set for my SC from the US

You can just buy a length of the SAE J30 R9 hose in 8mm and 10mm ID and cut to suit? Don’t need a kit as such.

Bob Watson fitted a new 964 fuel pump on my 911 when the 3.2 went down to be re-wired in 1995 and it is still perfect, no leaks.

Not sure the period correct pumps will be petrol tight. Is there a greater risk of pump leaks over pipe leaks?

I have been told BP & Shell high octane fuel us ethanol free. Can’t confirm that’s true but now try to make majority of fuel stops at one or other.

Shell isn’t ethanol free unfortunately, but I will always try and use V-power over other fuels when I can........ from their website :


The RFTO target is typically met through the use of bio-derived ethanol in petrol and Fatty Acid Methyl Ester (FAME) in diesel, which are blended into Shell’s UK fuel products in compliance with current UK fuels specifications (up to 5% ethanol in petrol and up to 7% FAME in diesel fuel). This means that, in the UK, Shell regular unleaded and Shell V-Power unleaded are likely to contain some ethanol, but it will not be present at more than 5% (in accordance with current UK specification requirements).

Thank you for correction. Anthony