DDK - Die Deutschen Klassiker

Hi

I have found that I have a rear axle seal leak. I have sourced brake shoes for both sides for the rear of the 356A T1 and a seal kit

Whilst struggling with one of the axle nuts, I thought I would sort the brake shoes on the 'good;' side

Anyway I cannot now get the drum back on !!! I have noticed that the shoes have plenty of meat on them whilst the leading edge shoes that are on the car already are missing about 3 cm off the shoe.

Am I meant to have taken this off ? Also if I do this then will it enable the drum to go back on ??

All very frustrating considering it is perfect driving weather today !! any guidance would be appreciated

Thanks Jeremy

1956 356A T1

Have you backed off the shoe adjusters? With a new set of shoes the setting for the worn shoes will be far too wide.

Did you get the axle nut off? It's done up to a monster torque setting so requires more than a 1/2" socket set

Jeremy - if the leak is a persistent one then you will need to do the replacement (and probably on both sides). Seal replacement can be a tricky job and removal of the axle nut is fun at times. I like my impact wrench to start the process.

I am currently replacing all my brake shoes, after having had them relined (another thread here). You should photograph each wheel so that you can return things to the same place. I even scribed each part and the matching drums in an inconspicuous place, with an engraving tool.

As Bruce says you must back off the adjusters completely. It is also a good idea to pull the adjusters off (not the cylinder-put a clamp on that if you have the brakes off for any substantial time) and throughly clean them and add a little high temp grease so they adjust easily when back on. The new brake shoe lining will probably be between 7-7.5mm thick? Much more than the old ones and hence the need to back off the adjusters as much as possible..

Not sure what you mean about 'the ones on the car missing 3cm off the shoe"? Do you mean that they have bevel on the edge, and your new ones don't? Your new brake shoes should be checked and radiused to suit the curvature of each drum to get the greatest contact area, or you will have only limited success. Most brake shops can do this for you. How are the metal linings on the rear drums? The rear brakes generally do less work than the fronts and what were those shoes like? Normally they wear more.

There are some very good threads on this process here and elsewhere, but you probably know all this anyway

Hello

Thanks for the responses.

Yes I did initially struggle with the nuts but got them off with a friends impact driver gadget (must get one for myself !)

I have cleaned and fitted the new shoes to one side and all the springs and parts went on fine.

I have backed off the adjusters and cannot see any other ways to reduce the overall diameter so that the drum will slip back over !!! I suspect it is something incredibly simple but I must not be spotting it !!

Thinking about the front shoe missing 3cm of meat - this must then be something more to do with the wear ?

I will revisit this evening and hope that my brain works it out - unless there is a totally obvious solution that I have not yet come across !!!

Once done I will then do the seal repair on the other side and then the now shoes - I hope that will be straight forward as long as I have cracked the shoe issue on this one

Thanks

Jeremy 356

Jeremy, how thick is the lining on the new shoes? More than 7.5mm? You can get then radiused to the drums there locally I am sure. Are the brake shoes centred properly on the adjusters? Sometimes they can hang up.

Hi Merv

They are about 7.5mm in thickness - I will get the other pair and see how they look in the drum for the radius

Drum looks good and healthy with good linings

I think that they are centred and have tried moving them up and down to see if that makes any difference. They do seem to be a bit more proud on the lower adjuster compared the other side but I cannot see how they could sit any deeper in the seat.

I suspect I am going to have to take it all apart and refit, just in case that will give make a change to something I cannot see.

Regards Jeremy

You can get oversized shoes for drums that have been machined/skimmed.

Perhaps you have a set of the oversized shoes ?

Drums should measure 280mm

Many thanks

I will get measuring this evening and also checking radius to make sure the shoes fit the roundness of the drums

I am sure that I have probably been stupid and if I take it all apart and put it back together again then it will all slot together nicely !!! Positive thinking !!

All the best
Regards Jeremy

7.5mm should be OK. My new ones are 7.3 and with the adjusters backed right off they went on easily. On the adjusters the 'slot' for the brake shoe is on an angle and only works one way. Otherwise the shoes will sit out too far. Did you check that too Jeremy?

You can make a tool for removing and replacing the small springs and retainers that hold the shoes on with an old screw driver and cutting a slot in it. Makes life easier.

I have checked all measurements and they seem to be pretty spot on

Also I have taken the other set of shoes and they fit nicely in the drum,

The adjusters are backed off totally

I suspect it is something to do with how the shoes are seating in the slots

The springs all seem fine and I was ok with fitting them but thanks for the tip

So I think I will start again and will double check each bit - should be straight forward ! Pretty frustrating

Then I can move onto sorting the seals on the other side !!!!!

Thanks Regards Jeremy

Maybe put up a photo of the shoes fitted Jeremy, after you check the angle of those slots. The shoes may need to be radiused/sanded slightly to fit the drums exactly. Brake shops do that quickly if you take your drums to them, with the shoes. (The handbrake is off right?)

Cheers

Merv

Ok I think I now understand the comment that the adjusters are 'angled'

I think mine are the wrong way round so the shoes are not fully seated in them.

I will open up the springs and turn them round and I think that will sort it !!!

thanks so much for all the advise and information, I really appreciate it

It is really reassuring to know that there are supportive people out there who are will to help

I will be back probably when I start on the seals !!!

KTF

Regards Jeremy

Jeremy,

Once you are sure the shoes fit into the adjuster slot the right way round hopefully all will be well. Those drums are secured with axle nuts to 400 foot pounds. You need to know pretty well that fiqure is reached. Can the system you used tell you that?

Roy

Hi Roy

Thanks for the advise

I am currently borrowing a torque gadget, which will tighten up to 600 lb ft so I think I have the right equipment for the job

Hopefully I will get on with sorting the 'easy' side this evening and then will look at the seal on the leaky side

Thanks again

Regards Jeremy

How did you go Jeremy?