Is this fair treatment from a fellow Ddk'er?

[Loz]

I've thought about this and decided to post because I feel it's completely the wrong way to treat a fellow enthusiast and having given the seller chance to put things right, he hasn't.

I recently bought a pair of Webers from a seller. I looked at the pics, read the description and put my name to them. Paid straight away, no dramas. Accept paypal or bank transfer? Paypal says the seller..

This whole thing revolves what people's perception of the word "refurb" means. To me I expected to completely strip down. New gaskets throughout. Fibre washers. Some new jets and screws perhaps? Even some linkage work, finally a good bath in the ultrasonic. Is that fair of me would you say?

This is what I bought....









.....and this is what greeted me out of the box!








Now. My question. How on earth do you refurb these? The seller says they are easily repaired by "liquid metal" or helicoil! Yes, Helicoil!!!! Oh dear. Now I'm starting to get a flavour of how this is going to pan out......and as of now, Im right!
The seller admits he should have included a few more details but has only partially refunded my money because he thinks they are worth the money broken down to individual components!! So what!!!
Oh, and of the money he has refunded, he says it's goodwill!!!
He blamed me for not paying using the 'gift' option, and yet he never at any point asked for that option! I tried to help by explaining he could just issue a refund through the transaction and all fees will not be incurred. No, he still moans about paying fees and only refunds some of my money, and refuses to pay for my postage back!! Great. Thanks very much Eric "mitso".
Enjoy the balance.

Not what I expected on here, or I should say, from a fellow enthusiast. I've dealt with a fair few guys and met my first DDK'er a couple of weeks back who couldn't be more helpful and welcoming.
Still, there's always one eh?

[Bootsy]

'Not what I expected here'

Please don't tar DDK in a bad way due to one personal sour experience

I agree. You didn't get what you paid for and the money should be refunded and the goods returned - end of affair

[Loz]

My apologies if you and others read it that way Tom....not my intention at all.

It's just that I'd rather not let others have a similar sour experience from the same seller.

Agreed. Case now closed and I am out of pocket, and he has his "spares or repair" carbs back.

[gridgway]

I don't think it matters where you buy something from. My experience is that many used (car) things that are less than pristine are described by their (private) sellers in very much more positive terms than I would use. So in fact I rarely buy such used stuff as I'm just so fussy!

I've just bought a covered trailer where I specifically asked it if leaked. No came the reply, bone dry. Well I saw it Monday in the rain and there were two clear leaks.

If it were me, I'd be quite careful buying something in need of a refurb. I'd want to do more investigation. I liked your description of what you thought the condition should be, but I think you assumed the seller had the same view. In a private sale clearly you have no come back unless the seller had "mis-represented". I don't think anyone would conclude that "refurb" is mis-representation.

Also you can have no real expectation of money back so if you got something, that's a bonus.

I'm not siding or trying to create a debate of the rights and wrongs - just pointing out that everyone needs to do their proper investigations before buying and perhaps us being involved in the world of rusty old german tat should be especially aware of that.

Graham

[Lightweight_911]

I would regard buying something from another DDKer in a different way from buying from an 'unknown' seller - I would expect items for sale to be accurately described ...

[hot66]

I would regard buying something from another DDKer in a different way from buying from an 'unknown' seller - I would expect items for sale to be accurately described ...

agree Andy

In this case, if you were unhappy Id have expected the seller to have taken the item back & refunded you . Its what I would do if someone wasnt' happy with an item I sold.

The casting being broken is something that should have been declared at point of sale and then any buyers could have weighed up wether the item was still worth taking a punt on or not

[MT]

I would regard buying something from another DDKer in a different way from buying from an 'unknown' seller - I would expect items for sale to be accurately described ...

I would also concur Andy, for the additional reason that in this case the seller (looking at his historical posts) is a regular seller (and buyer) on here and I would have thought reputation and record alone would have caused him to refund in full and without discussion.

There are a few instances (some quite entertaining) over on 911S registry where one can see what happens if you pi$$ on your chips.

As a regular ebay seller I am only too aware that buyers are also not without their peculiarities, but unless I feel I have evidence they are 'scamming' I just refund and swallow hard. Certainly if Loz had bought this on ebay he'd have a full refund by now.

Mick

[Nige]

The seller should have had the items returned and offered a full refund to buyer of the agreed sale price. Delivery costs in my opinion should be split 50/50.

Those carbs above are well shonky and go beyond what most people would call a general wear and tear refurb. They are damaged and should have been described as such at the point of sale, if they weren't then the seller needs to sort their sh*t out.

If they are a long term DDKer or any DDKer for that matter they should be ashamed.

[roy mawbey]

That guy must have realised what he was selling was more than the usual overhaul. The threaded stud alone with what looks like 'no thread ' is enough let alone the area tapped through by someone with no thought of what he was cutting into. No, that was not a fair description. He should have refunded if you were really unhappy possibly less the shipping costs involved.

Refurb can mean lots of things by all sorts of different people. I certainly would have expected better.

Guess you won't get caught again though in a hurry.

Roy

[anglophone1]

There are tossers everwhere- sadly!

[Nige]

Avatar in the image gives the game away a little.

[gridgway]

Well it's good to see that you guys have higher expectations than me! I just think that as a buyer, if you buy on those expectations, you are at risk. And yes that risk is reduced being in the company of a bunch of good guys and girls.

It's a private sale. Buyer beware. No obligation at all to refund (not even like ebay). There are no real obligations on the standard and detail of private advertising other than not lying and not mis-representing. The seller doesn't need to disclose anything at all.

The seller didn't say "usual overhaul" he said "refurb". I think a buyer would be nuts to assume that means overhaul of otherwise perfectly good carbs.

As it happens like many I think I have very high standards when selling. But it goes wrong all the time. I have been selling off my Radical parts. That included some good, very useable wheels. The rims on radical wheels get a bit knocked and scrape when they are placed on the ground. So I advertised them as being "in good condition". Absolutely true. One buyer came along and wanted "in good condition" to mean unmarked and wasn't happy with the wheels. So with the best of intentions, the meaning conveyed between buyer and seller, especially with short phrases really often goes wrong.

I don't think I'm too jaundiced as a buyer, but realistic in what happens. And I'm pleased to be in the company of people with high standards, but caveat emptor.
Graham

[Nige]

Not sure Graham, these are obviously damaged and are beyond the terms "require refurb" in my opinion.

Coincidence that the images on the for sale original thread don't show the damaged side?

Eitherway Loz should have bought Dellorto DRLAs instead of Weber.

I've bought and sold many parts on here and on IB and always expect a certain standard of play. Ebay, Gumtree and alike then yes buyer beware.

[squirdan]

Previous form / controversy re selling things I recall?

[Loz]

Gents,

Thanks for your comments. I'm not surprised that the majority share my view on this, and some comments have got it spot on!... but again, thanks for taking the time to post your opinions.

Graham, I understand what you say in your posts, but I disagree.

Eric had the opportunity when pointing his camera to turn over the carbs and photo the other side. He chose not to. Why do you think he chose not to? For one, I wouldn't have given them a second thought and moved on.
Eric, in his PMs even admits to not representing his carbs correctly. This alone should have resulted in a full refund without question. Legally I'm not certain where an individual stands and quite frankly I don't really care. This was never about the money. This was about how Eric reacted to the fact that I didn't lay down and take the medicine. He thought he could just sell his junk carbs, without a care of where he was doing it or who would buy them.
What followed was a trail of excuses, discourteous PMs and even a pathetic attempt to make his description sound better by editing his ad to include "origin unknown", only this Sunday gone....long after I had notified him of my disappointment, check the "for sale" section and you will see along with edit time stamp. So maybe you can now add deceit to this repartee.

I'm done. Job done. Could have been avoided. Not my choice.

Thanks again for your time.

***edit*** Nige, funny thing is I have 36DRLAs already! Thought these maybe a slight upgrade!

Dan.....thanks. I rest my case!!!