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356 / 912 engine query
Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2007 5:08 pm
by mad
in theory.....
....could you put 356 pistons and heads ....or just heads......onto a VW type 1 block ?
Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 2:19 am
by cubist
It's been done before... so why not? Bit of minor machining
Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 9:20 am
by mad
cool.....nice compramize of cheap performance block and authentice looking engine
i`m a happy chappy - cheers, cubist
i`ll keep you all posted with my progress
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:38 pm
by Airhead
I can tell you straight off that the stud pattern is different. May be able to take some measurements as I have my 912 engine in bits at the moment.
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 10:17 am
by mad
oh....
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 10:29 am
by davidppp
No, sorry, its not really on..although no doubt been done!
Everything is different..
The 356/912 is more akin to the pre 60 30Hp engine in fact..
Kind regards
David
36hp Unlimited
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 12:24 pm
by Schläfer
It's OK if you start of with what we call a 30hp motor (the yanks call it a 36hp). The weapon of choice is made up of the following: replace the VW 64mm crank with a 74mm 356/912 crank. I think you can squeeze an 83mm barrel/piston if you massage the spigot holes a little. The 36hp unlimited guys ususally stick to VW heads (Maybe because they like a challenge?) but usually Okrasa or if you very wealthy Denzel. 356 heads are much better though, you're roughly ending up with a higher capacity Pre-A engine.
You might find this link interesting:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=96565
Cheers
David
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 12:33 pm
by davidppp
Yes, indeed.
It can be done with the 30HP..and in fact IMHO the old 30HP engine has more ultimate power potential than the later engines..the crank is shorter and with appropriate reengineering(!)of a new foged crank and rods, ts possible to make a stiffer and stronger crank assembly, and its a bit lighter too..
Cylinder bore is a limitaion, obviously, but Nikasil is a big help..
I'm intirgued why you say that the 356 head is better than say a Denzel BTW..?
the Denzel looks a much better design IMHO...never actually worked on one..but the BHP obtained in the day was impressive...
Kind regards
David
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 2:00 pm
by mad
i`ve got a 30hp engine sat in my shed
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 2:10 pm
by mad
....what i`m looking ot create is a period authentice engine that creates acceptable power for a 59 356a.....and its got to be CHEAP
ok...so i have a 57 30hp block lying around so there`s a devent start.....69mm crank wouldnt be a problem....i`ve almost got a block here
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 2:28 pm
by mad
although reading on a 356 cranks seems the way...any one got one ?
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 3:16 pm
by Schläfer
I'm intirgued why you say that the 356 head is better than say a Denzel BTW..?
Sorry, misunderstanding. I meant that the 356 head would be better than a stock singleport VW. That said, if you go to the last page of that 36hp thread I posted, have a look at the single port head that Tom has made!
although reading on a 356 cranks seems the way...any one got one ?
If you're happy to use VW rods you'll be able to use a 356/912 crank which would be considered to far under on the rod journals for a Porsche motor. So they're useless to anyone else. Read through the post, it'll tell you anything you need to know.
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 3:24 pm
by mad
even better...anyone got an old 356 crank thats only good as a paper weight, i`ll give you 50p for it
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 6:48 pm
by Graham
I have a mid 1947 VW case with 356 cam rods barrels and heads on it!
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 8:50 pm
by Derek
Graham wrote:I have a mid 1947 VW case with 356 cam rods barrels and heads on it!
Do you have any pictures?