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Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:36 pm
by BILLY BEAN
stretch wrote:Glad it's all sorted Kirk. If you ever find that twat.... Let me have his address too.

Very amusing Dave...........and you know why.
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 10:34 am
by Boydyrs
The front torsion bars are stamped L&R and are crucial to geo. Any changes to front will effect rear and visa versa. I’ve seen a few 911 with TB wrong way round. On a wide body car could be even more crucial so great spot by Gary and team.
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 10:58 am
by inaglasshouse
Hi Kirk
Glad you are making progress.
Please ignore the king of seatbelts and his facetious windscreen suggestion. How about heated seats? The hardware is really cheap, eg:
https://bearmach.com/heated-seat-elemen ... s-ba-2410r
993 vs ST? Nice to have a big contrast - horses for courses?
Cheers, Richard.
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 10:59 am
by BILLY BEAN
Boydyrs wrote:The front torsion bars are stamped L&R and are crucial to geo. Any changes to front will effect rear and visa versa. I’ve seen a few 911 with TB wrong way round. On a wide body car could be even more crucial so great spot by Gary and team.
Thanks for the comment. The surprise was the amount the front "issue" impacted on the rear. Fortunately, the mystery has been found. Gary also noticed that one of the rear tires has lightly kissed the inner wheel arch. Just awaiting geo on Tuesday and hopefully get the car back on Wednesday.
Fingers crossed.
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 11:08 am
by Boydyrs
Kirk, I was advised early on by more qualified racers, mechanics that if you have a problem at the front adjust the rear and visa versa. I have always remembered this and it’s served me well and actually makes sense. I’ve dialled out understeer at front by adjusting tyre pressures, dropping tyre width size, geo and same for front. Trick is record everything in a small book by date and weather and only change one thing at a time. Hope this helps some way?
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 11:22 am
by BILLY BEAN
inaglasshouse wrote:Hi Kirk
Glad you are making progress.
Please ignore the king of seatbelts and his facetious windscreen suggestion. How about heated seats? The hardware is really cheap, eg:
https://bearmach.com/heated-seat-elemen ... s-ba-2410r
993 vs ST? Nice to have a big contrast - horses for courses?
Cheers, Richard.
Richard, I had considered heated seats for my bum, which is well into its seventh decade. The seats however run me a close second for age and still have their original foam. Given the history of issues with this car it would be my luck to BBQ the seat and my backside. However, as I am keen to use the car year round the heating elements are not completely off the agenda. Hope you are well.
Regards,
Kirk
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 11:27 am
by BILLY BEAN
Boydyrs wrote:Kirk, I was advised early on by more qualified racers, mechanics that if you have a problem at the front adjust the rear and visa versa. I have always remembered this and it’s served me well and actually makes sense. I’ve dialled out understeer at front by adjusting tyre pressures, dropping tyre width size, geo and same for front. Trick is record everything in a small book by date and weather and only change one thing at a time. Hope this helps some way?
Thanks again. I usually keep notes on a build but the later stage of the initial set up of the suspension I just got too lazy and too keen just to get the car on the road. So no notes. Sage advice from you on the suspension. After Gary has done his thing next week I will certainly note everything regarding the suspension set up. So at least we know where we are starting from should further adjustment be required.
Regards,
Kirk
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:46 pm
by inaglasshouse
Another pic from Kirk:

Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:45 pm
by BILLY BEAN
On Wednesday I picked the ST up from Gary Cook. The suspension has been sorted, new oil level sender, door lock that didn't sorted, locks all keyed to one key, screen washer working, plastic plugs in the drive shaft couplings to stop them losing grease and the MFI pump adjusted. Although the roads were a bit 'greasy' and there was light rain the car feels much better at the front end. The vagueness at the straight ahead position and a few degrees either side of that is now gone. Turn in is good and the tendency to understeer at moderate speeds now also absent. Speeding around a roundabout with a broken black top did produce a bit of front end sideways skip at the front. This suggests either too stiff springs and / or dampers. More miles in the car will allow a better assesment of the next step in the front suspension development.
The MFI idle rack has been weakened off in an attempt to deal with the light trailing throttle which the engine is unhappy with. The MFI does not transition smoothly between idle and main racks at between 2000 and 3000 RPM. The MFI adjustment has helped but not cured the issue. Again more miles on the engine and then a visit to a rolling road is due to improve matters.
Today I met Dave O'Connor at GDC as he was having a clutch adjustment and we were going for a short drive afterwards. On leaving GDC we had a couple of miles blat down a private single track drive to Horton in Bucks and then took the road to Buckingham and then towards Bicester with our destination of The Milk Shed cafe at Weston on the Green Oxon. Dave likes the Milk Shed as it is populated by nice looking yummy mummies. Me? I am much older than 911 Hillclimber and only attracted by the food. However, we were both disappointed as it was full to capacity with no parking available. We ventured forth to an alternative.Dave following as he does not know his way around the Oxfordshire environs. Looking in my mirror and there is no Dave behind me. Turning around I find him parked two wheels on the verge. Car obviously not going anywhere. Clutch pedal to the floor. This was his second event of the day. I will say no more on this as Dave will update his own thread. A call to GDC who is about 18 miles away. Gary is on his way to the rescue.
I decide to go get a sandwich whilst Dave languishes roadside. Back to the Milk Shed. On getting back into my car the starter hardly turns over. The car that just keeps on giving just gave a bit more. Call the AA . Long story short a total and utter waste of time. They can't come to my car as it does not have an MOT. Well it is a historic class vehicle and does not need one, cut no ice whatsoever. Call in a favour from Autofarm. Power pack arrives in 15 minutes. Car started. Question? Poor charging from a rebuilt alternator, poor lightweight battery or a crap starter motor. Maybe all contributed. But probably because I had left the heated front screen on. Note to self: improve memory ( hardly likely) or get a timed cut out for the heated screen.
Back to Dave to find Gary Cook in attendance. Dave points to the fact my flies are undone. My response? "Dead birds don't fall out of the nest". A favourite phrase of my dad.
Gary does his thing. The problem with Dave's car is at the pedal box end.
Am I pleased with the car? It has been a long time in the making and there are fewer issues now to resolve. It has cost far more than I ever imagined and upon a sale I would never get my money back. Note I did not say "investment" because it is no good dressing up the hard facts. However, it is terrific to drive, noisy, raw, cold, quick and brings about a great feeling of priceless contentment. I should have built this car many years ago as my time ahead is getting diminishingly short.
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Thu Dec 17, 2020 10:33 pm
by rhd racer
I think you should write a book Kirk. I’d read it. It’s quite a skill to make a disastrous day sound hilarious.
Glad the car is sorted
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Thu Dec 17, 2020 10:46 pm
by KS
Interesting point about the AA – I have just sent an e-mail to their press office to get the official word on this as it could have far reaching ramifications (as in the majority of classic car owners not having the cover they've paid for...).
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Thu Dec 17, 2020 11:16 pm
by BILLY BEAN
rhd racer wrote:I think you should write a book Kirk. I’d read it. It’s quite a skill to make a disastrous day sound hilarious.
Glad the car is sorted
You are most kind. Flattery will get you lots of rewards. How much do you want?
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Thu Dec 17, 2020 11:24 pm
by BILLY BEAN
KS wrote:Interesting point about the AA – I have just sent an e-mail to their press office to get the official word on this as it could have far reaching ramifications (as in the majority of classic car owners not having the cover they've paid for...).
My other old car does have an MOT. The ST Clone does not
but will get one at some point in the first half of next year. Unfortunately Keith it took 30 minutes to get to that point without managing to talk to anyone at the AA. It was the unfortunate cycle of press this, press that and ended up with the DVLA advising the AA that I do not have an MOT and can't therefore send anyone to assist. I was then given a link with a telephone number which rang a few times before going dead. Tried three times with the same result. Tried messaging the AA and explained the car did not need an MOT. Nope that did not help either. When I got back home I tried to contact the AA to praise them for their totally useless service. Of course it was impossible, even after trying various telephone numbers, because you end up getting right back where you started after listening to endless messages and then press this, press that etc etc infinitum. Very frustrating. Only renewed my AA Membership in September and feel I have been conned.
Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2020 9:25 am
by Hugo 356
BILLY BEAN wrote: "Dead birds don't fall out of the nest".

Re: 1972 ST Clone
Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2020 10:01 am
by anglophone1
KS wrote:Interesting point about the AA – I have just sent an e-mail to their press office to get the official word on this as it could have far reaching ramifications (as in the majority of classic car owners not having the cover they've paid for...).
Why do the AA have to check with DVLA before assisting? Makes no sense to me......