Restoring my first 914

For all you Porsche 914 fanatics!

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John_F
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by John_F »

Hi Darren,

Very impressed with your restoration so far. Not being that practical myself I have to pay to have mine done. However, I am trying to do various clean up jobs myself, one of which is removing the old adhesive from the firewall in the engine compartment (photo attached) - a slow job.

Image

I would certainly be interested in purchasing some of your leftover bulkhead sound proofing. Did you make a template or just use the old sound proofing for one? If you made a template I would also be interested in this. I would also be interested in a couple of wire hose clips for the rainwater drain tubes onto the funnels. Mine are just push-fitted on at the moment although they are a tight fit.

Like you, I am also missing the the knurled nut & post that secures the cover to the relay box plus the 2 horse shoe cable retaining clips (photo attached).

Image

Will try Auto Atlanta for the clips.
Can you PM me with price details for the sound proofing & payment details?
Kind regards,
John.
914 KEV
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by 914 KEV »

Good Luck with the restoration Darren, your engine compartment looks very nice.

I very much like the colour Alaska Blue... one day I will get round to getting mine back on the road, but it will need quite a bit of welding!

Keep the updates coming as they made interesting reading.

Just like to comment on a couple of points.
Darren C wrote:With reference to the fuel hose, I opted for the externally braided "period" type, but it does have the latest "suitable for unleaded fuel" printed in fine writing and the supplier assured me it was ok. Granted the E10 thing is a problem, but unless you do a lot of continental driving it's in low percentage mixes over here. Thankfully.
E10 fuel is available in the UK and the standard E5 unleaded will be phased out over a period of time.

You might not be aware, that back in July 1977 914s were recalled to have their fuel hoses replaced from the braided single wall type to the high pressure double wall smooth type.
It was know as the 'HO recall campaign' for the 83,000 Porsche 914s imported into North America and was completed over a number of years.
But a few would have slipped through the net as they would have had been re-sold on from the original owners and were not getting serviced by the main dealer and Porsche had no way of contacting every current 914 owner and not every 914 owner at the time booked their 914 in to have the work done.

The fuel injection fuel loop is regulated at 28psi for the 1.7 & 2.0 and 35psi for the fuel injected US spec 1.8.
The last thing you want is to have a major fuel leak due to swelling hoses caused by the ethanol and the single wall rubber to split as the ethanol rots the rubber from the inside!
I have had personal experience of seeing single wall new braided fuel hoses leak on 914s after only a short period of time after they had being fitted; now I only fit R9 or higher spec fuel hose.
Darren C wrote:My relay box in the engine bay had a smashed up cover.(or should I say "what was left of it") I managed to get a brand new replica one (quality a bit suspect) and the knurled retaining nut plus the two horse shoe cable retaining clips from Auto Atlanta, but I'm missing the post that screws into the relay board, passes through the cover and the knurled nut attaches to.
The original engine bay relay covers were never that great quality and the fit was never perfect.
From the 75 model year they never fitted the post on the relay board and the cover didn't have the hole for the post either and just sat on top of the relay board.
The reason they changed it was the hole would let water through on to the relays and often crack around the hole.
Always make sure there is a washer on the top of the post before the cover is fitted, as this helps to seal the hole and to help stop the cover from cracking when the knurled nut is tightened.
914 Daily driver since 1990
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by John_F »

Kev wrote:
"The original engine bay relay covers were never that great quality and the fit was never perfect.
From the 75 model year they never fitted the post on the relay board and the cover didn't have the hole for the post either and just sat on top of the relay board.
The reason they changed it was the hole would let water through on to the relays and often crack around the hole.
Always make sure there is a washer on the top of the post before the cover is fitted, as this helps to seal the hole and to help stop the cover from cracking when the knurled nut is tightened."


Hi Kev,
Went back to look at my relay box cover. I now realise that my cover must be a later addition as my car is a '73 2.0. There is no hole for the post in the cover to have a nut attached. The cover is just loose on the base. Unlikely to fall off but does rattle a bit.

Hope my old HEs were fit for purpose!

Kind regards,

John.
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by Darren C »

No Problem John, I’ll send you enough material to make a new soundproofing pad. Is £10 ok for it, and say 50p each for the drain water clips, plus the postage at cost? If so, pm me your address and I’ll send one out to you. I used my old pad as a template. Drew carefully around it with one of my son’s old “colouring in” pencils (the white pencil that never gets used on white paper!) It’s a tough old material to cut and I used a combination of some very heavy duty scissors, Stanley knife and tin snips. Top tip is to paint the back and edges to seal the fibres and also stop it from soaking up water easily. It took me two evenings to make and around 2 hours each night, but the result is well worth it.

Thanks for the advice on the fuel hose Kevin. I know this is going to be controversial but I have so many issues with the FI, parts missing or damaged and a fault on the ECU which I think wont let the fuel pump run, that I’m considering carb conversion. I have a complete new set of 40IDF, manifolds and linkages (with stainless fittings I made on my lathe) in my shed never fitted to a car. I’m persevering with the FI at the moment, but if I take the Carb route :shock: the pressure will only be running at 4PSI.
I had to replace the wires down to the fuel pump and found the PO had hot wired the pump + wire to the Coil + terminal to get an ignition feed. I’ve now returned the loom to original and cant get power to the pump? There is continuity from the relay to the pump, but no power on the relay coil? I read a post on Pelican parts when people opted for a 6 cylinder conversion and couldn’t get power to the retro fuel pump after removing the ECU. They then hot wire the relay board feed to the missing rear window relay feed & earth to activate the fuel pump relay. Looking at the wiring diagram on the relay board there are only 4 spades on the ECU loom plug, therefore if the ECU feeds the fuel pump relay coil I can test this by linking two pins to determine an ECU fault….but which two? Anyone been down this route before?

Interesting history on the relay cover there. My original has a big stress fracture around where the post and knurled nut goes and the front missing. The new repro one from Auto Atlanta has a raised boss around the post hole. This obviously is an attempt to stop water ingress and thickens up the material to add more strength. I think I will make two soft rubber washers to go under and over the cover where the knurled nut fits.

Progress today….

Managed to google a good Beru part number x-ref for the ignition leads and called in at my local Motor Factors during my lunch break and ordered a set. 2 hours later a phone call to say they were in so picked them up tonight.
I also had a nice stainless coil clamp arrive in the post along with a “battery mat” from Frosts. (£9.14 made me smile at the apt price) Ready to slip under my new 063 Battery to protect that new tray. Cut it to size tonight and added 4 slots about 2” long on each side towards the centre. The battery tray has a lower pressed section in the middle with a drain hole, should the mat not have slots any level of rain water couldn’t get to that drain hole, so sit ¼” deep in the tray.
The Coil clamp was a sore point. I bought a brand new Bosch black coil and sent my original coil clamp with the tinware to be powder coated satin black. Came back lovely. Trouble is, I went to fit it at the weekend and found that the new Bosch Black coil is a smaller diameter than the old factory one and won’t hold in the original clamp. What a pain! So I now needed a new coil clamp with a through bolt to install it.

I do like a white car John. You can see everything easily when it comes to rust. The slightest stain before the rot sets in. Ideal colour for an OCD restoration man like me :wink:
Keep at it John, I’d love to see your progress too.
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by 914 KEV »

Darren C wrote:Thanks for the advice on the fuel hose Kevin. I know this is going to be controversial but I have so many issues with the FI, parts missing or damaged and a fault on the ECU which I think wont let the fuel pump run, that I’m considering carb conversion. I have a complete new set of 40IDF, manifolds and linkages (with stainless fittings I made on my lathe) in my shed never fitted to a car. I’m persevering with the FI at the moment, but if I take the Carb route :shock: the pressure will only be running at 4PSI.
I had to replace the wires down to the fuel pump and found the PO had hot wired the pump + wire to the Coil + terminal to get an ignition feed. I’ve now returned the loom to original and cant get power to the pump? There is continuity from the relay to the pump, but no power on the relay coil? I read a post on Pelican parts when people opted for a 6 cylinder conversion and couldn’t get power to the retro fuel pump after removing the ECU. They then hot wire the relay board feed to the missing rear window relay feed & earth to activate the fuel pump relay. Looking at the wiring diagram on the relay board there are only 4 spades on the ECU loom plug, therefore if the ECU feeds the fuel pump relay coil I can test this by linking two pins to determine an ECU fault….but which two? Anyone been down this route before?
My advice is don’t give up on the FI just yet, power to fuel pump relay is only a minor problem.
If you can’t get the fuel injection to work, you could always call in the UK 914 expert! You have my phone number. :wink:

You may not be aware that the fuel pump relay (3rd from front) gets its power from the main power relay on the relay board (2nd from front). If this is not switching there will be no power to the fuel pump relay.
Only the rear fuse holder is used and should be fitted with a 25 amp fuse and is linked to the battery.
The switching input power is from the ignition switch.
Due to corrosion from water on the relay sockets and relay pins they might need cleaning to restore proper electrical contact.

If you unplug the positive wire to the coil (Black) and then unplug the fuel injection wiring harness from the relay board and place a link wire between the two nearside terminals (III & IV) and with power going to the relay board, the fuel pump should run continuously.
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Darren C
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by Darren C »

Thanks Kev,

Under normal functioning of the ECU are you saying it switches inside to link pins III & IV, allowing the fuel pump to run when the ignition is switched on?
Taking the +ve off the coil shouldn't effect this test.....or is it just to remove the risk of burning the coil out while the test takes place?

John, if you haven't got a soundproof pad as guide to cutting the material I can mark it out for you if you want before I send the material out.

Cheers
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by 914 KEV »

Darren C wrote:Under normal functioning of the ECU are you saying it switches inside to link pins III & IV, allowing the fuel pump to run when the ignition is switched on?
No

Switching of the fuel pump is on pin III from the ECU and is a pulse controlled from one side of the lower points in the distributor via the electronics.
Darren C wrote:Taking the +ve off the coil shouldn't effect this test.....or is it just to remove the risk of burning the coil out while the test takes place?
The reason I disconnect the +ve wire from the coil is: if the points were closed with power running through them, it is not just the coil that gets hot; it can lead to the insulation block on the points to melt and the insulation on the wire from the points to the coil and then the +ve wire.
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by Nick Moss »

With reference to the fuel hose, I opted for the externally braided "period" type, but it does have the latest "suitable for unleaded fuel" printed in fine writing and the supplier assured me it was ok. Granted the E10 thing is a problem, but unless you do a lot of continental driving it's in low percentage mixes over here. Thankfully.
Change all the new or old braided hoses to modern fuel injection hose, don't risk your car.
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John_F
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by John_F »

Darren wrote:

"John, if you haven't got a soundproof pad as guide to cutting the material I can mark it out for you if you want before I send the material out."

Darren,
That would be incredibly helpful - thank you so much! Please let me know by PM total cost of all parts including postage & preferred payment method.

Kind regards,

John.
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by Darren C »

No problem at all John, it would be my pleasure to help you out.

Nick et al,…don’t panic! I’ve ordered some internal braided rubber hose and have a nice new fire extinguisher to fit in the car.

So on to tonight’s escapades in my workshop (known to my close friends as “Black Op’s Department" of D.C. Shed Industries Inc)……..

Well all the soundproof material I had left over has been allocated to you guy’s and so I carefully marked out on each piece the cutting template, and packed it all up for postage out. I took one piece to the Post office in my lunch break and weighed it for postage, it’s a heavy/bulky thing so the cheapest & best is Express 48 at £12.98. John, I have your address so I’ll send yours out tomorrow, can the others pm me an address and I’ll try and get the remaining out tomorrow as well.
Rummaging through my draws in the shed tonight I found a tray of Fir tree trim plugs so I’ve packed enough with each piece of sound proofing to allow you to fit them FOC.
Top tip I can offer to anyone fitting a new pad is to first remove the engine cover (2 M6 bolts), bend all retaining tabs clear, cover the engine with newspaper, and masking tape the perimeter of the pad on the bulkhead and rear window.
DRY fit the pad WITHOUT any glue. I used a very high temp spray contact adhesive from Woolies, but any similar will do. The reasoning behind the dry run is that any contact adhesive will grab the pad and there isn’t enough room in the engine bay to avoid this if you put the glue on first. Particularly as you need to wrestle the pad into place.
There are 3 holes along the bulkhead half way up. These are for the Fir tree clips that hold the pad on across its centre. I found that it was easiest and logical to fit the pad across the bottom behind the wiring loom and jiggle it left and right with a couple of screwdrivers poking through the pad and into the holes in the bulkhead. You then know for sure its correct when the two outer holes line up. I then pinched tight the two tabs at the bottom (just above the hell holes) to lock it in place. Next I draped it back so it lay on top of the engine (surrounded by newspaper placed earlier) Only then did I spray both surfaces with the contact glue; when it was in the car. Let it get just touch dry and then with screwdrivers as a guide through the holes just hinge it up to meet the bulkhead and work it firmly in contact. I also used a hot air gun to warm the centre section (prior to sticking) to soften it and allow it to fit into the concave middle of the bulkhead. Finally bend over and tap with a plastic or rubber mallet all the surrounding securing tabs firmly down and fit Fir tree plugs in the holes where you've had the screwdrivers.

So on to tonight….

The blower fan in the engine bay, like most of the car, was full of sand when I took it off. After emptying it out, it made a god awful grinding noise and was hard to turn. I stripped it down tonight and found that after taking the 3 nuts off that hold the motor and fan into the housing, it was obvious the impellor was rubbing the motor base. When I pulled on the impellor it came away about 3mm, so it looked like an end float issue. Once the impellor was off, I could see that there was a small wire circlip that limits the taper fan fit to the shaft and a worn thrust washer that the circlip runs against, plus yes more sand!
The only solution I could think of was to make a new thrust washer about 2mm thick to “shim” the impellor away from the motor mount. This I did on my lathe to the exact sizes (very fiddly making a washer 2mm thick with a 1.5mm difference between id and od) Anyhow, I cleaned out the motor casing (washed it through with electrical cleaner to remove yet more sand) and re assembled it with a smear of grease in the bearings. Hey presto spins silently. Next I cleaned up the terminals and bench tested it on my new battery. It surprised me as its more powerful than you’d think; but it ran well.
I treated the motor to a buff polish with a brass wire wheel, and T cut the dull black fan casing. The whole blower motor came up like new and still retains the white printed 914 part number!
I took off what was left of the paper/ali air hose a few weeks back when I removed the fan for the engine bay paint. It was a hard task trying to find a new bit of hose, but last week half a metre came in the post that was a perfect fit. I’m still not 100% happy as I couldn’t find it with a paper outer finish, only ali/paper/ali sandwich rather than visa versa. (its an odd size id to find also) Anyhow it’s a bit shiny ali-bling bling looking but will be functional at last. I finished off tonight cleaning up the original hose clips and under the gunk, found they are engraved with VW badges that made me smile. They’ll certainly be going back on in all their new found clean glory. :)

So bedtime reading tonight is the current flow diagram for the FI ECU. I need to understand how it works to be able to diagnose and fix mine.
Kev, I need to get my head around your advice about the pump being “pulse” controlled. It’s a standard relay feed and the coil in the pump relay wouldn’t like a pulse, it would chatter and overheat, so I can’t quite understand what you mean.
I get the fact that the power comes from the power relay, then when the pump relay coil is energised it feeds the pump (or not in my case), but need to learn more from you about this pulsing? I have two other cars with K-Jetronic (slightly different I know with metering heads and all) but it’s a constant feed on both those cars fuel pumps, so I’m kinda confused a little at the moment :?:
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by 914 KEV »

Darren C wrote:So bedtime reading tonight is the current flow diagram for the FI ECU. I need to understand how it works to be able to diagnose and fix mine.
Kev, I need to get my head around your advice about the pump being “pulse” controlled. It’s a standard relay feed and the coil in the pump relay wouldn’t like a pulse, it would chatter and overheat, so I can’t quite understand what you mean.
I get the fact that the power comes from the power relay, then when the pump relay coil is energised it feeds the pump (or not in my case), but need to learn more from you about this pulsing? I have two other cars with K-Jetronic (slightly different I know with metering heads and all) but it’s a constant feed on both those cars fuel pumps, so I’m kinda confused a little at the moment :?:
The fuel pump running input into the ECU is a pulse from the twin point’s plate in the lower part of the distributor. They switch on only for a fraction on every rotation of the distributor shaft via a cam, the lower points also switch the fuel injectors two at a time. (Front pair, Rear pair).
The reason the fuel pump is pulsed is that in an accident it will switch off when the engine is not running.
The lower point’s contacts do get dirty and should be cleaned with mentholated spirits from time to time.

As I see it the problem you are having has nothing to do with the ECU, it might be a bad relay or a corroded contact. Relays don’t last forever and are a common item that stops the 914 from running and a spare should be carried. As most 914s don’t have a heated rear window the spare is stored in the relay socket for the heated rear window. (Front relay socket)
With ignition ON, check that you have voltage at the rear fuse holder on the relay board and the inner post of the front fuse holder. If yes the second from the front relay should switch when you remove it and again when you re-plug it in. If not, try another relay and check that the pins and socket are not corroded. If this relay does not switch the fuel pump relay (3rd from front) won't switch to operate the fuel pump.

All the round black relays on a 914 are the same.
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Darren C
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by Darren C »

Tonight I have mostly been……

Turning down some stainless bar on my lathe to make the missing relay board cover post. Not having one to copy, I just used Imagineering, and made a support collar (threaded and locked onto the shaft) at the height of the cover. From an old car inner tube I used my punch set to make a rubber cushion (water seal) washer to go on the collar (shown on top of the regulator)

Image

As I said earlier in this thread, the new Auto Atlanta relay board cover quality is not good. I agree with comments made by others that the originals weren’t that clever anyway. However the problem I have with the new one is that in places its wafer thin. If you hold it up to the light you can see clean through the crucifix crossed top part. If you pressed more than very lightly in this area you’d push a hole in it. It’s almost as if someone poured the resin into a mould, swished it around a little and let it set. All the resin flowed into the low parts and the raised parts got barely coated more than the thickness of a coat of paint!
Anyway, to resolve this I have spread a layer of Tiger PU bond on the inside to strengthen it all up. Hopefully this will do the trick.
Outwardly though it does look far better than the old broken one that came with the car.

Image

While I was waiting for the PU bond to cure I fitted my new water drain hose to the new funnels I got from Porsche Centre. The hose I found is quite a good visual match to the no longer available original and has a spiral re-enforcement and yet is smooth on the inside so wont hold water.
The clips I got are a perfect match, if a little tough to fit. ( I used mole grips to pinch and lock them open, screwed the tube into them then pushed in the funnel ends before letting go) Also I have the clip ends facing outwards, since there is little room in the engine bay I didn’t want them to scratch or cut the back of my hands when working in there.
All parts ready to go back in at the weekend when I have the benefit of daylight.

I also ordered up a new spare genuine Porsche fuel pump relay, to aid investigation of the fault my car has (and keep as a spare. Thanks for the advice Kev).
My new fuel hose arrived. Printed on it good for E10 and for 25 bar! Another small job to change over at the weekend.
I got to the post office too in my lunch break and sent out the soundproofing to John, so hopefully you’ll have it for the weekend. Peter I got your message so will post as instructed the end of next week.
Managed to pick up a bit of new hose for the oil breather system when I was getting the fuel hose today plus some stainless clamps for it.
Bring on the weekend! :)
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by myatt1972 »

Loving the daily progress, certainly puts me to shame.
But lets get to the important stuff, what lathe is that ?
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by DaveW »

I had to do some head scratching on mine (with the help of Kevin and a mate who is an electronics whizz). Oddly, two relays went on my board at the same time, so swapping them round might not fix it if the same has happened! I also had to replace the MAF.
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Re: Restoring my first 914

Post by Mr Pharmacist »

DaveW wrote:I had to do some head scratching on mine (with the help of Kevin and a mate who is an electronics whizz). Oddly, two relays went on my board at the same time, so swapping them round might not fix it if the same has happened! I also had to replace the MAF.
The same happened on mine - 2 relays had gone so nothing worked and neither did swapping them around!
Stuart

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