DDK - Die Deutschen Klassiker

Great to see you have started and underway with this cracker.
Lots of pics please!

The early 944 hubs that fit the 944 / beetle steel trailing arms look like below. The version for the alloy arms is different. Not sure what the Imor kit uses.

Hi Bruce,

Using the 1303 stub axle which I believe to be same splines as the early 944. Any idea how to use later alloy callipers?

Correct, the 1303 splined sub axle is the same as the early 944 item, except for having a different CV size. The later hubs have a different bearing design, compared to the early 944 & 1303 design. Which bearing does the Aftermarket upright use?

The hub in my photo above is 477501065 (82-85 944 NA for steel arms).

If you want to use the turbo alloy calipers (which use axial mount & not the modern radial style). Guidance from “vee Dub engineering” is copied below (not verified by me!)

“So what about Turbo brakes on a bug without the aluminum arm? You can use the turbo rotor (86 only) (299×24) and 4 piston brembo on the early (85.5 and earlier) removable backing plate. The rotor and caliper will bolt on, and you will have to shim the caliper (3mm) a little laterally to center it over the rotor. Use longer bolts for safety if you use the shims. See our product listings for the Turbo hardware kit (longer bolts and shims). If you use a Boxster S (986S) rotor (200-2008), you will not have to shim with the 4 piston 944 rear caliper.”

Thanks for the help. I believe the imohr hubs use standard 1303 bearings on the rear. I did speak with them regarding upgraded brakes, but no real help.
Downloaded a VPN extension to allow me to look at American sites who don't have compliance with data protection. The vee dub engineering site really does have some fantastic information. Will read through more thoroughly than before.

Rear
Looks like there is a combination of parts to allow use of the 901 box, 1303 stub axle, cv's, early 944 hubs, 986S disks, 944 T callipers/ pads. I guess the next step is to track down all the parts and work out what combinations fit together. I used a custom handbrake cable on the speedster which worked well. A similar route should also allow me to use the 550 style handbrake.


Front
The front seems to be the stumbling block with fitting later 944 callipers. This company in Germany Eyptec sell a 5x130 hub which fits the standard beetle spindle (trying to confirm 1968 and later)

Radnabe Käfer aus Alumium mit Porsche Lochkreis 5x130 Lochkreisadapter

They also may sell backplates and adapter combination for the 944 callipers. Struggling to get an answer from them, they just keep saying we are not 100% sure. The dropped spindle may also complicate the issue further for back plate combinations. Again the vee dub engineering site may offer the answers.

I have 944 turbo brakes on my speedster with standard master cylinder which are well balanced and work well given the light weight of the car. Brakes don't lock up, grab during heavy or light braking.

As mentioned a need to source a load of second hand and new parts and see what fits. Also need to look at brake bias devices to get the front/ rear balance right. I could not use a brake bias device on the speedster due to IVA regulations.

greg356a wrote:Also need to look at brake bias devices to get the front/ rear balance right. I could not use a brake bias device on the speedster due to IVA regulations.

But surely this build will have to be IVA compliant, too, as from what I can see it only meets five or possibly six (depending on the engine choice) of the required eight points needed to avoid IVA.

1. Chassis or monocoque bodyshell (body and chassis as one unit) (original or new)
Direct replacement from the manufacturers - 5 points
2. Suspension (front & back) - 2 points
3. Axles (both) - 2 points
4. Transmission - 2 points
5. Steering assembly - 2 points
6. Engine - 1 point

For handbrake.

You can use the stock beetle cable (shortened or not depending if the pan is stock length or not).

To match up the beetle “hook” to the mech, you replace with a “swan neck” part. Or you can take a grinder to the 944 part and cut a notch.

Stock 944 part:-

And the swan neck replacement part.



Also in the photo is the sleeve that supports the handbrake cable guide tube. This fits over the steel 944 part as the beetle guide tube butts up against the 944 part & does not fit inside.

Bruce - useful info on hand brake options. Hope to read through the vee dubs website stuff tonight. So far the front end mods seem to be around machining the spindles.

Keith - Looks like my thinking maybe wrong, may need to IVA. Is this the process you took with the 914? Must say I thought there was an exemption for cars over 10 years old

Keith,

Screen shot from the Gov website, classification of cars over 10 years old not apply?

IVA by Greg Moore, on Flickr

Body/ chassis, steering assembly, axles-drive shafts & spindles, engine = 10 points.

greg356a wrote: Keith - Looks like my thinking maybe wrong, may need to IVA. Is this the process you took with the 914?

No, all I had to do was register the car as normal - DVLA asked for an inspection simply to check the details. As you well know, IVA is a whole different ballgame and has significant implications regarding the build. I believe there's quite a long thread on here by some guy called greg356a about the subject while building his Speedster...

The exemption above assumes the vehicle is totally stock.

You have five points for the chassis (assuming it hasn't been cut to fit the new suspension, transmission etc), but after that things get a bit sketchy. Lose a potential two points for the suspension change, another two for 'axles', two for transmission, two for steering, leaving one point gained for the engine (assuming it's an enlarged Type 1).

One way round it (although not strictly 100 per cent by the book) would be to get the car on the road and registered as a stock KG and go from there...

But be aware, if registered as a VHI (vehicle of historic interest – ie tax and MOT exempt) DVLA is getting very sniffy these days, even keeping watch on forums to see what is going on and withdrawing V5c documents if they suspect ( or see) that changes have been made that affect the vehicle's status. There are stories of hot rods having their V5c revoked as a consequence of this...

So IVA for a rebuilt vehicle or radically altered vehicle is probably a good thing apart from the low point score and potential Q-Plate. With some limited IVA experience the build will be compliant eg, electrical, seats, etc. Applying the rebuilt vehicle route Yes, the chassis will be unmodified and maybe the two major components could be selected from engine (type 1) / gearbox. I assume they allow for original components to be rebuilt/ refurbished. Not sure vw transmission has any serial numbers.

One question would be, so I bought the car from the USA and it came with IRS original parts ie axle etc. So what does it mean by "used parts from the original vehicle"? As originally made or as bought?

No issues with IVA compliance actually believe whilst sometimes limiting it is a good idea. Certainly should give confidence to any future buyer.

Worst case would be a Q-Plate, most likely by the time I get the car built the rules will have changed numerous times and will have to fit an electric motor! Now there's a thought!

Original-specification parts are fine, whether they are original to the vehicle or not. You can also do 'safety upgrades' (brakes) which are non-stock so long as they adapt to stock 'axles'. 'Used parts from the original vehicle' means as fitted by factory, not as bought (ie, you couldn't get by with a blown Chevy V8 in a 1932 Ford just because it was fitted to the car when you imported it. Several people have fallen foul of the temptation to buy a seemingly cheap street rod from the USA only to find it can't be registered without IVA.

Are you on Facebook, by any chance? If you (or a partner) can look up Kev Rooney, then ask to buy his guide to the whole IVA thing. As you know, the DVLA/VOSA IVA manual is over 200 pages of often indecipherable gobbledygook , but Kev, using his years of experience in the rodding scene, has produced a user-friendly version for which he charges just £20, all of which goes to charity. Worth buying it.