DDK - Die Deutschen Klassiker

We think it's all 2.4S graham, it could well be a bit peaky, I'm looking forward to trying it out!

Today's topic...brakes. I had been very unhappy with the brakes. Very wooden and no bite. Quite a good pedal, but not rock solid if that makes sense. Fronts are S spec calipers (so L&M calipers).

To try and make a difference, I changed the front pads for some greenstuff ones (some people love em, some hate em). It definitely made a difference to almost acceptable. I got them bedded in and working, so that was good.

Then last weekend I saw Will Chappell selling some used pagid blue pads which are expensive new to try on a whim, but used, worth trying. They arrived all as described. No taper or anything worrying going on. So I popped them in yesterday and went for a blat.

Result, fabulous, they work very well indeed, considerably better bite and ability to lock the wheels. The pedal feel is the same, a bit so so. I'll do a bleed of the brakes, but I doubt it'll make any difference as they don't feel soft like there is air.

Then I might investigate whether there is a bigger m/c to try. I know that only changes the feel not the effectiveness, but that's what I'd like really a firmer pedal now the stopping power is there.

My preference after pads and fluid changes is to replace the rubber flexi pipes with Goodridge stainless or similar to give me the pedal feel, I prefer. I’ve been doing it on bikes and cars for years and it's consistent and it works for me.
No idea if it’s the feel you are looking, sorry.

Interesting idea Derek. Will look into that.
Graham

..
S alloy calipers suffer from 'flexing' which can affect brake efficiency.

A worthwhile upgrade is to swap the brakes for 3.2 Carrera discs & calipers ...

.

A callipers up front on 3.5" struts, M callipers on rear.
Drilled stock size 2.4 discs, and the secret ingredient, French Carbone pads all round.
Stock master, Aeroquip flex lines, dot 4 fluid.

Bit noises, but will STOP you.
Ask Darren 65 too.

Then I might investigate whether there is a bigger m/c to try. I know that only changes the feel not the effectiveness, but that's what I'd like really a firmer pedal now the stopping power is there.

[/quote]

I tried a larger master cylinder on mine, after being told it would improve the feel of the pedal. I did not, it made it feel rock solid with no feel whatsoever, and you had to push like mad to get anything to work.
It was brand new, stayed on for that one drive and removed, and the correct diameter found from Europe, you are welcome to try it, but stick to the original diameter for standard set up to be honest

Lightweight_911 wrote:..
S alloy calipers suffer from 'flexing' which can affect brake efficiency.

A worthwhile upgrade is to swap the brakes for 3.2 Carrera discs & calipers ...

.

I swapped my S callipers to 3.2 Carrera discs / callipers and it was a great improvement. Definitely worth doing if your not happy with the current set up.

911hillclimber wrote:....and the secret ingredient, French Carbone pads all round.
Stock master, Aeroquip flex lines, dot 4 fluid.

Do you mean Carbone Lorraine?

If so more info here:

https://www.cl-brakes.co.uk/pad-compoun ... ained.html

Also use these (RC5+ compound) on my heavily tweaked 3.7 litre 986 Boxster (road trip/track car) and they're definitely the "secret ingredient" along with the other tweaks 911hillclimber describes. They replaced the Pagid Blue/front and OE/rear which worked well in this application - RC5+ front and rear very clearly upgraded the braking performance. A full set will go onto the 3.6SC as part of its recommissioning later this year.

yoda wrote:

Lightweight_911 wrote:..
S alloy calipers suffer from 'flexing' which can affect brake efficiency.

A worthwhile upgrade is to swap the brakes for 3.2 Carrera discs & calipers ...

.

I swapped my S callipers to 3.2 Carrera discs / callipers and it was a great improvement. Definitely worth doing if your not happy with the current set up.

Looks like a common theme. I assume this is just on the front?

yoda wrote:

Lightweight_911 wrote:..
S alloy calipers suffer from 'flexing' which can affect brake efficiency.

A worthwhile upgrade is to swap the brakes for 3.2 Carrera discs & calipers ...

.

I swapped my S callipers to 3.2 Carrera discs / callipers and it was a great improvement. Definitely worth doing if your not happy with the current set up.

I did the same on my S too . Its not night & day, but I could feel the flex with the S calipers

I have never had anything but S callipers on either our Hillclimb 911 or our 914/6, and have never found them wanting, or particularly noticed any flex.
The difference after installing CL pads on both of them was night and day though. The first few Hillclimb meetings after fitting the CL pads, I found I was braking far too early, they were so much more effective.

They are noisy though, when pottering around the lanes ……….

JW

gridgway wrote:

yoda wrote:

Lightweight_911 wrote:..
S alloy calipers suffer from 'flexing' which can affect brake efficiency.

A worthwhile upgrade is to swap the brakes for 3.2 Carrera discs & calipers ...

.

I swapped my S callipers to 3.2 Carrera discs / callipers and it was a great improvement. Definitely worth doing if your not happy with the current set up.

Looks like a common theme. I assume this is just on the front?

Yes, just the fronts on mine.

Thanks Feroz.

And for those CL users, which if the pad compounds are you using?

Use RC5+
The old RC5's were very noisy, the +'s seem to have fixed most of that and a few other issues (I think they've got better bite from cold, etc)
I use RC6 in my track car and they're astounding when warm, but a bit too wooden and noisy on the road so I'd say if this is a fast road car then don't go with them

Beautiful car by the way graham - pretty much the dream colour combo!