Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Ongoing and archived Porsche (and other marques) restoration threads from DDK members

Moderator: Bootsy

Post Reply
User avatar
PeterK
DDK rules my life!
Posts: 1068
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:04 pm
Location: GU51 - Fleet, Hampshire, UK

Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by PeterK »

I’ve promised so many times now that I really had to get my finger out and start a thread on the restoration of my ’79 Targa.
As a bit of background, I recently completed the nut and bolt rebuild, sunroof delete, EFI with ITBs, etc - but of a Lotus Elan Plus 2. I had a very narrow garage, that was filled with motorbike and stuff, so couldn’t tackle anything that might need body metalwork. I bought a bare shell & 5 boxes of bits, and needed a fair bit of eBay and specialist shopping. I took the car back to gelcoat on the drive, filled the sunroof hole, fixed up a couple of stress cracks and borrowed a carport to paint it in. Unfortunately the compressor was not up to the task, and despite trying to paint around the poor atomisation by laying it on thicker, the finish looked poor and somewhat crazed after 6 months. Back to gelcoat again, and respray 2 was done in a tent in my front yard. It was lovely and warm, but clearly the air must have been too humid, as the top horizontal surfaces all suffered with micro-blisters within 6 months. Luckily we moved and at last I had a garage big enough to get a car into. Back to gelcoat for the top half and respray 3 finally nailed it. God I’m sick of rubbing down fibreglass bodies !
My boxes of bits excluded an engine, so a 2 litre silver-top Zetec engine, so an Emerald ECU and Jenvey TBs soon sorted that. I built a full custom wiring loom from scratch (went from 4 to 46 fuses and from 1 to 16 relays ). Fully adjustable suspension including rose jointed front wishbones, kept it on the road. I was told the gearbox was OK, but it felt notchy. When I opened the case I found a plastic bag containing some, but not all, of the needle roller bearings, so clearly someone had started but bailed previously.

Image

Anyway, always wanted a 911, preferably a late model IB, ideally a G50, 88/89 3.2. As a ‘youf’, turbos were always too far out of reach of my pocket money, so the 3.2 wide-body was the dream car, and strangely it still is.

I’d owned a 944 before moving to OZ and breeding, but never been in a 911. As prices got increasingly silly I had all but given up on my dream resto, so SWMBO bought me a Dream Ride charity ride at CarFest last year. Chatting to the driver, he had a project too many, and it accidentally ended up in my garage. I paid too much considering what he had paid just 6 weeks previously, but it was very cheap compared to anything else around. On close inspection it seems basically sound, although it needed kidney bowls, patching of the sills and just behind the battery box. Door gaps were appalling, most seals on the Targa and doors needed replacing, the exhaust was blowing, the engine had a slight mis-fire under load, it leaked like the Torrey Canyon, the tyres were shot and 5th gear couldn’t be found. But it was a 911, it wasn’t silly money and it was going to be mine. I love a challenge

So starting from this

Image

Image

Image

Image
Last edited by PeterK on Thu May 18, 2017 10:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
'79 Targa - restoration now mainly complete & being driven
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59756
User avatar
PeterK
DDK rules my life!
Posts: 1068
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:04 pm
Location: GU51 - Fleet, Hampshire, UK

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by PeterK »

So I got it home and gave it a service but the misfire remained. I found damaged connectors on the plug leads and a rough looking distributor cap, so they were changed, but the misfire still remained. The couple of missing air plugs were replaced and the exhaust headers were welded up, but the misfire remained and the noise was less, but not sorted.
Image

Setting the rear gearbox selector coupling didn’t reveal 5th gear, but in better news, but 5th gear was found when I realised that the gearstick was twisted, and the reverse block was actually stopping selection of 5th. Just a quick twist of the gearstick and 5th gear was returned.

The driver’s side window didn’t move – which probably had something to do with the actuating arm being in the froot. I got some stainless bent up and welded to replace the window channel, and all went back together nicely. Shortly after, the nearside window fell down into the door. The support channel wasn’t that bad, and probably could have been patched, but I duplicated the driver’s side.

Image

Image

So step 1 of the resto proper was to remove the engine and ‘box. Almost everything came apart quickly, with only one rear ARB mounting bolt shearing. Progress ground to a halt when the bolts on the outer CVs were found to be too rounded. I tried hex keys, torx keys, 12 point keys, and then decided to remove the engine on its own. Unfortunately the engine wouldn’t separate from the gearbox, so back to arguing with the CV bolts. I removed the wheels, used an impact driver and several extension bars, and belted the bu$$ers. Result - half of them came out. About an hour with hammer and chisel had the rest out and me with very achy shoulders.
The little grub screw in the gear linkage coupler was mullered, so had to be drilled out. I’ve helicoiled it now, so just new bushes needed.
Once the engine was out it was clear that I had removed the wrong starter motor bolt, so that explained why the engine and box were reluctant to separate !.

Image


Then a good day’s play time mid-week, and the front bumper, wings, screens and petrol tank are out.

So, what have we learned. Well, some areas are rustier than I thought, but not significantly. Some areas that I thought were trouble, weren't as bad as expected. Oh, and bagging the nuts and bolts and small parts results in a lot of small bags !.

Worst area is the nearside b-post / striker plate. It was clear during my initial inspection that some ‘MOT’ welding had been done on the lower rear wing and the b-post had been repaired, perhaps even more than once. When I dug into the rusty area, a lovely shaped piece of filler came away, revealing the metal underneath had been added over the top of rusty metal, and had not been rust prevention treated very well – most of the patch had already rotted away. The forward edge of the kidney bowl was absent, although the top and rear side were fine. However, I knew this was a poor area and had already decided that the b-post and sill would need replacing during my pre-purchase inspection. The other side appears much better, but will also be changed.
Image

Other findings include ….
The rubber pads that sit between the bumper shock (not) absorbers and the back of the front bumper were in the froot !.
The oil cooler has been welded to the main pipes, so were removed as a unit, including the thermostat. Not sure what I’ll do here yet – leave well alone, cut the cooler off and fit new connectors, or something else.
The wiring has areas around the headlights that make me wonder how the car hadn’t caught fire.
Oh, and there's been some mischief afoot in the front. Not sure that the nearside bumper mounting is completely stock
Image


INNER FRONT WINGS
The nearside inner wing has had previous treatment. The patch and welding look good, but why do people lap weld patches. One of the patches, behind the battery tray, will need replacing. Given the state of the bumper mount area, it may need more removing to tidy the area up.
The driver’s inner wing needs a patch at the top of the bumper mount (only visible from the inside). I’ll remove the bumper mount to repair this area, fit a new mount, and while I’m there, the oil cooler support is on its last legs. There’s a few holes appearing at the rearmost, top part –where the oil pipes keep the mud warm – bit like Sladey’s car, but not quite as bad.
Image
Sorry that’s a tad blured, but you should get the idea
Last edited by PeterK on Thu May 18, 2017 9:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
'79 Targa - restoration now mainly complete & being driven
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59756
User avatar
PeterK
DDK rules my life!
Posts: 1068
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:04 pm
Location: GU51 - Fleet, Hampshire, UK

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by PeterK »

Moving onto the engine, and off came most bits to leave me with a long block. I took all of the induction off as a single item. The exhausts came without heat, but I want to fit SSIs with heat. So far, I’ve found one broken head stud, and a hole where another used to be (same inlet side, opposite end outer bolts) - someone has previously removed the end of the broken bolt, so new nut and washer ordered. Was planning to get steel studs for the exhaust side, but my local OPC storeman made me bottle it at the last minute. Didn’t buy the Dilivar, and reading Dempsey, I still plan to go all steel. How do you pronounce Dilivar ? – is is dil e var, dee live ar, or what ??
One side of the engine suffered with 4 broken bolts for the tin ware, so some drilling out required. Now waiting on a camshaft holding tool before I can go any further.
Obviously the cylinders will have to come off to fix the broken head studs, and while I’m there I’ll replace all the Dilivar. As most of the engine will then be in bits, I planned to split the case and renew bearings – hoping the crank will be in spec. That said, a trip to collect my sills from Porsche and a discussion with the parts man – apparently a set of bearings is around 400, so maybe some research into pries, etc. is warranted !


Screens and seats were already out, so next I took the rest of the interior out (just a very hairy seat area now), most seals off and then attacked the Targa bar. On both sides, one nut came off easily from under the rear wings but the other was rusted away. I cut holes in the top of the striker plates, and tried but failed with adjustable grips.
Image

The top of the rear wings by the bolts were none too clever, so I just chiselled the wing around the bolt heads and removed the Targa bar. I’m hoping that I can use a good section of a sill as a starting point for making replacement pieces – well at least it will be closer than a flat sheet of steel.
Image

The dash top was a nightmare until I realised that I could see and reach the securing bolts from inside the froot. All gauges safely in the loft and wiring loom hanging out in several places.
Last edited by PeterK on Thu May 18, 2017 9:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
'79 Targa - restoration now mainly complete & being driven
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59756
User avatar
PeterK
DDK rules my life!
Posts: 1068
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:04 pm
Location: GU51 - Fleet, Hampshire, UK

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by PeterK »

Time to tackle the inner wings.

First the near-side. The front section had been plated, and looked sound from the outside. Unfortunately, the repairs had plated with about and inch / 25mm of overlap, with no rust treatment in the old material which was rough and bent, but internally filled with copious amounts of underseal.
The bumper mounting bracket had obviously received some attention and modification.
Image

Having (eventually) removed the residual bumper bracket, I decided to run a cutting disc around the edge, discard the outside of the newer plate and the inner of the original plate
Image

I had marked where the bumper bracket met the front panel, and had drilled through the spot weld corresponding to the hole in the new bracket to use as a datum (where the nut and bolt is parked). It was soon clear that the patch panel prevented the new bumper bracket from sitting where it should. It was going to take more than some panel beating to make sufficient clearance, so I cut out the middle area. I brushed on some Fe123 for temporary protection.
Image


The off-side inner wing had not looked too bad. The front section looked tatty, but sound on the outside, although there was clearly rust on the inside, corresponding to the top of the bumper bracket.
Image

It was a nightmare to remove the bumper bracket. I drilled out the spot welds that I could find, used a cutting disc to section the bracket, and chiselled it off in bits. I knew that I had to plate some of the inner wing, and now have a slightly bigger area to patch than I anticipated !
Image

The sharpie markings are to triangulate the rear datum point for locating the new bracket - I need to replace and remake that rear section of inner wing.
Again Fe123 for temporary protection.
Last edited by PeterK on Wed May 17, 2017 5:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
'79 Targa - restoration now mainly complete & being driven
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59756
911hillclimber
Nurse, I think I need some assistance
Posts: 18855
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 6:26 pm
Location: West Midlands

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by 911hillclimber »

Good grief!
Looking forward to seeing this one come back to life. :)
73T 911 Coupe, road/hillclimber 3.2L
Lola t 492 / 3.2 hillclimb racer
Boxster 987 Gen II 2.9
TheEasyLife
I luv DDK!
Posts: 866
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2007 11:56 am
Location: Leicestershire

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by TheEasyLife »

Cool. Another 79 Targa! I wanted a 78 or 79 Targa in White. Couldn't find one in white (but wasn't looking that hard). As I'm not touching mine till this time next year, I'll sit back and see how to do it properly :-).

And at least yours came with paint on it unlike mine.....

Cheers

James
1979 SC Targa - Long term project - in storage - purchased 10/16 - last looked at it in 08/18..
Fascinated with 911 seats and induction systems!

Previously
1973 911T in Gulf Blue (with 2.4E ITB's, EFI and EDIS) - from 07 till 16. Sorely missed.
User avatar
PeterK
DDK rules my life!
Posts: 1068
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:04 pm
Location: GU51 - Fleet, Hampshire, UK

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by PeterK »

The best bit about mine James was that it was all there and all together. Having built the Lotus from a shell, just trying to work out what was missing was a nightmare :lol:

At least you don't have the hassle of removing the paint !
Peter
'79 Targa - restoration now mainly complete & being driven
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59756
User avatar
PeterK
DDK rules my life!
Posts: 1068
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:04 pm
Location: GU51 - Fleet, Hampshire, UK

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by PeterK »

At last a little bit of mending rather than taking apart ….

But before that, a quick shot of the pile of rusty bits hacked off the bumper mounts
Image

Didn’t get much done today, but a milestone nonetheless - my first patch panel. Needed two attempts and two parts of cardboard engineering, but I managed to create a single panel in steel and it is held in place ready for trimming of the rusty metal underneath and then welding in.
From this
Image

….to this
Image

Well, at least it's progress ( I hope) :bounce: :cheers:
Last edited by PeterK on Wed May 17, 2017 5:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
'79 Targa - restoration now mainly complete & being driven
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59756
User avatar
PeterK
DDK rules my life!
Posts: 1068
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:04 pm
Location: GU51 - Fleet, Hampshire, UK

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by PeterK »

So, a few hours later and welding went fine(ish). Penetration seemed good, but to check the welds, I ground them back flush to ensure that there were no gaps or cracks. Things looked a tad thin in a couple of places, so I ran a bead of weld around the edges again. Unfortunately that resulted in a few blow-throughs, so the old drizzle weld was called into play to fill the holes. This time I didn’t grind the welds back so far . Anyway, this is what I ended up with
Image

and from the inside this (I did remember to spot weld the top inner, inner wing along with a couple of short tack welds on the edge) Image

A blast of Fe123 and time for tea
Image

Cutting and grinding creates a whole $h1t-load of mess, so I decided to clean up before tackling the near side.

Anyway, today I had a hour free, so cracked on ….

The inner wing (aside from the butchered bumper mount) didn’t look too bad initially, but having removed what was left of the bumper mount, it was clear that there were patches on top of patches, most of which were lapped joints, with loads of bent and rusty metal left showing and catching rubbish. Laying the new bumper mount against the existing panel showed that the panel was way out of shape. Anyway, long story short – it all had to go, and I’m glad I did.

First off, having re-read Sladey’s thread again, I used his idea of strips of metal to create a reference for the rear location hole of the new bumper mount.
Image

As I gradually cut out to (more) decent metal, the botches from before became apparent
Image
Image

Once all the grot was cut out and cleaned up, I ended up with this for the day Image

I was running out of time, so a quick coat of Fe123 ended the day. Another area to explore is here
Image
Two pipes enter the inside of the inner wing (fuel vent and washers) but only the fuel breather exits on the outside. A bit of digging required, but that will have to wait for another day.
Last edited by PeterK on Wed May 17, 2017 5:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
'79 Targa - restoration now mainly complete & being driven
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59756
Burma-Shave
Put a fork in me, I'm done!
Posts: 1934
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2006 9:52 pm
Location: Fife, Scotland

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by Burma-Shave »

Another 79 Targa here. Obviously they are best and fastest, etc etc. :-)

Good luck with the project, finding rust, bodges and more rust seems to be the standard drill fort this part of the job.

Not that it is relevant to the resto, I like the grey and black Fuchs, really looks good against the white.
'89 964 C4 - staying. '78 928 manual - going actually.
And..'89 BMW E30 325i Touring. '83 Mercedes 280E. '84 Citroen 2CV. '16 BMW i3 REx. '17 Yamaha XSR700. '99 Yamaha R1. '79 BMW R100RT scrambler.

Member#0336
User avatar
PeterK
DDK rules my life!
Posts: 1068
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:04 pm
Location: GU51 - Fleet, Hampshire, UK

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by PeterK »

SC targas are definitely the bestest Johnny :bounce:

Snuck out into the garage a couple of times over the weekend and made a start on the bumper support area of the nsf inner wing.
I’ve decided to try Flickr, as I was getting fed up of having to retrieve the laptop from where I threw it in the garden every time the frustration of Photocrash got too much, so expect some strangeness as I work out what I'm meant to be doing. I'll also probably go back and change the sources of previous photos. Unfortunately, Flickr does nothing to improve the original quality of my snaps – need to force the flash on, to cut the camera shake – sorry about that.

First off I cleaned up the area – evidence of previous metal ‘welded’ to original seam sealer ! I tried to cardboard engineer a complete patch panel, but too many curves floating in free space, so made a quick patch panel just to support the bumper support bracket.
Image


And welded in and coated in Fe123
Image

Image

My welding must be getting better already, as there was a lot less grinding this time.
'79 Targa - restoration now mainly complete & being driven
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59756
User avatar
PeterK
DDK rules my life!
Posts: 1068
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:04 pm
Location: GU51 - Fleet, Hampshire, UK

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by PeterK »

So, following a slight distraction, all posts now point to photos on Flickr in place of the unreliable, crashing place.

Been working hard, but not a lot to show for it really, so sorry for the lack of updates.

So, been finishing off the front part of the NSF inner wing
Image

and finally (this was actually done after the bits below, but it seemed more logical to tag it onto the other NSF inner wing ramblings).

Image

Image

Image


Then got distracted making a door hinge pin removal tool from some 5mm plate. I cut a slot in one piece to go under the pin head, a short piece as a spacer for the head and then a final piece to go over the head for putting it back in later. Unfortunately, the tool wasn’t strong enough for the pin, despite giving it some beans with a big hammer, it only moved a short way before the tool started looking a bit sorry for itself. Need to try again.


So another distraction – some door bracing ready for the sills. Not really needed just yet as I’ve plenty to keep me occupied on the rear halves of both inner front wings and the dash & screen surrounds. But it was fun and a break from the patch panels.
Image


Then back to patch panel making, starting with those for the rear of OSF inner wing
Image

Image

Image


and some patch panels for top of dash & screen surround, all on the OS
Image

Image

Certainly having fun trying to make these new patch panels, using the FBH, chisels, sand bag and shrinker / stretcher.


That’s me up to date for now but it maybe a few weeks until I get to play again.
'79 Targa - restoration now mainly complete & being driven
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59756
jjeffries
DDK slapper chatter
Posts: 313
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2015 9:23 pm

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by jjeffries »

Peter, looks like you need a new inner wing, at least that multi-perforated area with the ribs in it? I wouldn't want to rely on patching that. I had to do the front bumper reinforcements (like you) on my 82 coupe, but luckily the rest of the inner wing was ok.
Good luck, John in CT/USA.
User avatar
PeterK
DDK rules my life!
Posts: 1068
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:04 pm
Location: GU51 - Fleet, Hampshire, UK

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by PeterK »

Thanks John
Strangely the metal around the perforations appears really thick & strong. I know that mud builds up on the warm oil pipes, so rust is common in this area, but how does rust get so localised ?
Peter
'79 Targa - restoration now mainly complete & being driven
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59756
User avatar
PeterK
DDK rules my life!
Posts: 1068
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:04 pm
Location: GU51 - Fleet, Hampshire, UK

Re: Wot, not another '79 Targa resto thread

Post by PeterK »

Well, that was a longer break than I expected. What with household chores, holiday, more household chores, visitors, more household chores, it was only rain stopping garden chores today that allowed me a quick dash into the garage !

Anyway, decided to have a go at the OSF inner wing, the rear part above the oil pipes. Only managed to get one patch panel trimmed and fitted – just outside of the strut – by the only progress in a while.

Image

and with primer
Image

Here's hoping that I can slope off into the garage during the week while SWMBO is at work :bounce:
'79 Targa - restoration now mainly complete & being driven
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59756
Post Reply