DDK - Die Deutschen Klassiker

Mike wrote: Ben Coles on the other hand, be careful there.....

Darren, these are the original high butterflies that Ben Coles used to make his copies-
-
Don't know how his reproductions turned out, but they should be good, as he had the originals for a loooong time

Darren, is the thought of the high 's purely a cosmetic one or has Redtek suggested them from a performance point of view ... My guess is you're fantasy engine building in your head ... As we all do from time to time

Personally I'd stick with mfi, but put together a cost effective solution based of what you already have. Reality is your not going to go backwards, so either sell the 2.2s system now as it is , or mod them as you want . This car is being built properly so unlikely to be down graded anytime in the future

All that injection is very sexy and goes right along with a superb 2.5 in a great shell, but i for one would seriously look to a straight set of PMO' carbs.

They really are instruments, way above the weber carbs, use DCOE jets and the service from Rich Parr at PMO is second to none.
You can even tune them yourself using very basic kit from Halfords and other suppliers.
Fuel lines are simple low pressure, simple clips and pump.
They come ready jetted from PMO so you are almost ready to go out of the box.

Mike wrote:Hi Darren, well you did ask.... . Hope that helps and gives you more ideas to explore.

Thanks Mike, exactly the sort of input I was seeking and much to take on board…..I'm not overly concerned about the correctness of a 2.5ST lump in a narrow car, easy enough to fit flares at a later date if I ever feel the need although I prefer a skinny look……..I'm keen to utilise what I've inherited which obviously includes the MFI although must admit Paul's engine bay does look delicious!

brembo wrote:Don't know how his reproductions turned out, but they should be good, as he had the originals for a loooong time

Not just yours by the sound of things Dougie! ……and that's another seriously sexy engine bay!

hot66 wrote:Darren, is the thought of the high 's purely a cosmetic one or has Redtek suggested them from a performance point of view ... My guess is you're fantasy engine building in your head ... As we all do from time to time

Exactly that James…....you're fully aware that technically I know diddly!

Original spec was based on Nick's input based on cost and what I have to start with….my only criteria was that it should go like stink and scream like a banshee!….it's the talk recently of HB's and ST engine specs that got me thinking of whether I should be going that little bit further both cosmetically and performance wise, is my original spec a bit half way?……….then it comes down to if I'm moving too far away from my original build remit?

911hillclimber wrote:You can even tune them yourself

…..thanks Graham, I enjoyed that one!

I'm seeing Nick this week and obviously I'd be a fool not to follow his recommendations although greatly appreciate everyone's input which will certainly help with the decision making process….all nice choices to be considering!

Cheers,

Hi Darren, high butterfly is cool stuff. We have a NOS set here and will also be making a full kit, this will link in with our fully rebuilt and adjustable MFI pumps, it just all takes time. At the moment we are focusing on making new mfi bodies and stacks so these may lo give you another option as these can be bored out to a variety of sizes, plus they are all new. Should have sample castings this week.





Alan

what about slides Darren? you can also get a proper airbox with filter that mates to the slides

and they look v sexy

Cŏ′mpromĩse¹ (-z) n. settlement of dispute by mutual
concession; (finding of) intermediate way between
conflicting opinions, courses, etc., by modification of
each. [ME, f. OF compromis f. LL compromissum neut.
p.p. (as n.) of COM (promittere PROMISE²)]

Darren65 wrote:Cŏ′mpromĩse¹ (-z) n. settlement of dispute by mutual
concession; (finding of) intermediate way between
conflicting opinions, courses, etc., by modification of
each. [ME, f. OF compromis f. LL compromissum neut.
p.p. (as n.) of COM (promittere PROMISE²)]

I guess with any project there's always a degree of compromise and give and take……however as things progress and you learn, there's some things that you convince yourself that just have to be; that special steering wheel, those Weidman wheels, the Cibié Biodes, Mahle Barrels and Pistons, etc. etc. ….and so the list goes on…..

Well this week I spoke with Nick at Redtek and discussed my engine build. Looking at how he'd marked up my barrels waiting on the shelf I could pretty much guess his line of thinking…



No surprises from an engine builder, his thoughts are pretty simple…if you really want to ensure you squeeze the maximum power out of the engine and for it to look the part, then go with high butterflies!

The rationale was straightforward, it's a 1972 RHD T shell that will have been expertly rebuilt by one of the best in the business, it will have a 2.2S engine uprated to 2.5 litres using genuine Mahle 89x66mm barrels and pistons mated to a period correct 915 gearbox with ZF limited slip differential, and there will be a host of period items that add to the build from the headlights, to the roll hoop, to plexiglass, to Monza wheel etc. etc……it's a pretty heady mix and, should it be decided at some point in the future to go the ST route, a perfect platform to start from…

…not for me though, at least not now….I never planned the ST path and this is no Olive Tart, I've neither the knowledge or the dedication, or indeed the financial resources, to go down that route and I kinda like the fact that this build is wrong in so many ways (but will hopefully turn out right) and, if someone wants to tack on some wide arches and fit fat wheels in the future, then…easy peasy!

For now I'll content myself by selling off all my excess S engine parts along with the many other items I've accumulated along the way to help fund the fitting of some HB's…....I'll compromise by keeping the standard injection pump….I've not accumulated THAT many excess spare parts!

My initial concern was sticking to my imaginary build criteria and whether my 1978 guy would have fitted HB's, but then if he could have, I'm pretty damned sure he would have!

Alas, the HB's from Matt Blast may be a little (lot) out of my reach however I've had a strong recommendation for the items Ben Coles produces and will check these out. The HB's at Eleven Parts are magnesium and priced well although the linkages don't look great, anyone have any experience of these?

The strip down of the engine starts next week….can't wait!

Cheers,

I think you are thinking straight Darren. Make the car to the spec that you want/can afford. Seems to me you are correctly focused on quality not replicating another car.

Do yer own thing Dazza.

My only suggestion is that you drive a few cars with varying spec - including your 2.5 ST jobby - if they won't let you drive then at least get a passenger ride. you'll then at least have an idea of what you're letting yourself in for - you don't want to create something you aren't happy driving, or more likely you don't want to spend an extra 10K on something when you actually preferred the cheaper version

Drive something beforehand! ....now that would be a first!

The car's going to be pretty peaky whichever way I go....this won't be a car to take shopping down the high street and nor do I want it to be......loud and feisty all the way with this one!

As much as I'd love them, I couldn't justify a NOS set of HB's at £10K +, however there are reproduction sets available for around the £4-£5K mark which I'm told are very good, if I can sell a few bits for a couple of thousand it'll make the upgrade workable; need to see the repro items first though and may even backtrack and stay with a larger bore street system if they don't come up to scratch. We'll see!

Headers and exhaust system sorted though ......



Cheers,

Darren, HB's here - http://www.historika.co.uk/porsche-part ... stem/2.htm
Don't know prices, but might have to forfeit some body parts.

Darren, can't help with the HB dilemma (you knew that!) but those headers look bloody lovely

What brand of headers are those Darren - hopefully not OBX ...

Also which silencer ?