911 2.7RS

hot66 · Post by **hot66** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 9:01 am

wrong bonnet badge
interior parts are repros
suspension height wrong
missing trim on rear bumpers
missing air flapper box on engine
missing side window sticker

I haven't even studied the photos in detail either

all can be solved, but you have to wonder wether there are other areas that have been skimped on?

Normally the above would be OK etc , its just this car is very serious money by the time its imported. I think VAT will payable too so you're probo at £265K

Spydermon · Post by **Spydermon** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 9:05 am

Bertroex wrote:Counselling sessions can be organised!!!!

DDK crowd is rather hard to please, but if you are aiming for something, you might was well aim for the best.

You know what, I'm really missing pmjt here in this discussion. Come on phil, out of the woodwork with you! We'll bite only a little bit.

Bert

I might be heading for your couch Bert! I'm trying to aim for the best, but can't find it, yet.

This market is like 'Alice through the Looking Glass'; what you think is, isn't. And what you think isn't, might be. And what you think might be, could be? A 'real' RS that is, or is it.
<<looks in vain for the smilie that says 'wibble', pencils in nostrils and hankie on head>>
Pee Ess. Who is PMJT, and what is this conversation missing please?

Steve.

Spydermon · Post by **Spydermon** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:30 am

hot66 wrote:wrong bonnet badge
interior parts are repros
suspension height wrong
missing trim on rear bumpers
missing air flapper box on engine
missing side window sticker

I haven't even studied the photos in detail either

all can be solved, but you have to wonder wether there are other areas that have been skimped on?

Normally the above would be OK etc , its just this car is very serious money by the time its imported. I think VAT will payable too so you're probo at £265K

Thanks James,

Ok, so I'm beginning to see this car as a problem, but a very good-looking problem, bit like the T+S........

Boo Hiss....! AH well, moving swiftly on....<<deep sigh>>

'Murder your darlings' as we say in writing, and 'all that glisters is not gold,'

If it was in the UK though? So, are there any in the UK? Onward and upward, or should I just ring P*ul St*phens.........<<runs and hides>>

Steve

Roadrunner · Post by **Roadrunner** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:37 am

Spydermon wrote:Hi all, and thanks to everybody for their great responses. Here's a quick update of where I'm at.

I've followed up all the links so far and have frozen my bandwidth with the amount of e-mails sent to people in the know.

I have yet to see or hear of a car for sale or coming up that is as good as the OZ one. The Gulf car at Hairpin doesn't show sold yet and they haven't replied to my price request yet.
I'm going to try a second email to the Classic throttle shop asking just why this car is so expensive. Much as I want to buy the car that I desire, neither do I want to become the owner of 'that orange one that was 60k more than everything else.'!

If the UK specialists don't respond to my e-mails I'm going to have to take a day out to ring them all.

I like the Viper Green car at Fiskens, but am not sure about the yellow bit at the back, or, for some strange reason, the steering wheel!

Should anybody have anything further to add please do; and thanks too for the great PM's.

Cheers,

Steve.

I really strongly recomend that you go and see the Fiskens car 'in the flesh' - it is stunning, and the repainting of an engine cover / replacement of a steering wheel are simple and cheap in the grand scheme of things....

sladey · Post by **sladey** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:54 am

Hi Steve,

Welcome to DDK.

You've mentioned Paul Stevens offerings as a joke. I personally don't like the 964 backdates, but his earlier ones (based on impact bumper cars) are apparently very good now, and the autofarm ones are also very high quality.

However the thought that comes to me is to ask why you want the car? If it's to put in the garage as an appreciating asset then a correct original RS would be ideal (disclaimer: Bullsh1t can go down as well as up). If you want to drive it as it was intended are you going to be comfortable throwing 200K of moolah round a track or even in a spirited way on the road?

There's a well known guy who was at the silverstone trackday last July (sorry don't know his name) who had an original ST (more valuable than the RS?) - he loved it to bits but when values got high enough he sold it and built a very close replica for a fraction of the cost which he now really enjoys on track. It's faster than the original, built exactly as he wants it, and he gets far more enjoyment out of it than the original. More bang for your buck I would say. Mike on this board is now re-creating a millimetre-perfect RSR-rep, having sold his millimetre prefect RS rep last year. This was referred to by Josh Sadler (of autofarm) as like driving the real thing, and when you get down the level of detail that Mike went to it was exactly the same car.

I'll admit to being biased here as my own car is a backdated 87 carrera (http://www.ddk-online.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=6932 and in this month's total 911 - media whore)

I just wanted to throw this into the pot because I wouldn't want you to buy it to drive it and then find you don't feel comfortable using it. I wouldn't be making these comments if RS values hadn't shot so high.

Whatever you decide good luck in your search - I'm watching this thread with interest.

Cheers

Mark

Spydermon · Post by **Spydermon** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 11:40 am

sladey wrote:Hi Steve,

Welcome to DDK.

You've mentioned Paul Stevens offerings as a joke. I personally don't like the 964 backdates, but his earlier ones (based on impact bumper cars) are apparently very good now, and the autofarm ones are also very high quality.

However the thought that comes to me is to ask why you want the car? If it's to put in the garage as an appreciating asset then a correct original RS would be ideal (disclaimer: Bullsh1t can go down as well as up). If you want to drive it as it was intended are you going to be comfortable throwing 200K of moolah round a track or even in a spirited way on the road?

There's a well known guy who was at the silverstone trackday last July (sorry don't know his name) who had an original ST (more valuable than the RS?) - he loved it to bits but when values got high enough he sold it and built a very close replica for a fraction of the cost which he now really enjoys on track. It's faster than the original, built exactly as he wants it, and he gets far more enjoyment out of it than the original. More bang for your buck I would say. Mike on this board is now re-creating a millimetre-perfect RSR-rep, having sold his millimetre prefect RS rep last year. This was referred to by Josh Sadler (of autofarm) as like driving the real thing, and when you get down the level of detail that Mike went to it was exactly the same car.

I'll admit to being biased here as my own car is a backdated 87 carrera (http://www.ddk-online.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=6932 and in this month's total 911 - media whore)

I just wanted to throw this into the pot because I wouldn't want you to buy it to drive it and then find you don't feel comfortable using it. I wouldn't be making these comments if RS values hadn't shot so high.

Whatever you decide good luck in your search - I'm watching this thread with interest.

Cheers

Mark

Hi Mark,

To clarify: I'm not saying that Paul Stephens cars are a joke, I was using them as an ironic example of being the furthest away from a 'pure' or 'real' RS. I know that they have their place and that they are done well, I didn't mean to disaparage Paul Stephens efforts or the quality of their cars.

Your is an interesting post and I thank you for it. You raise a very good point, and one that I've thought about a lot. If I put everything I'm thinking on here it would be twenty pages long and very boring, also I wouldn't have the time to do it. So, I'm trying to keep it interesting and relevant.

This is a difficult debate, a 'real' one for best, and a hooning replica. Which to choose? If I was really interested in doing trackdays above say touring and events, I'd buy a Radical and a trailer and a Landy. So, I suppose the answer is; I'll buy the best one I can afford and nail it until I need to fix it. I won't be precious about it, and have already factored in (from previous posts) amounts needed to rebuild engines and such.

But if I went to the Nurburgring in it, I'd do my best round there, or anywhere. But I'm not short of driving/riding very fast round roads, hill or track experiences, just short of doing them in a 911 RS. So I want one because I've never been able to own one before now, and I want to repeat a lot of those experiences in a car that, to me, is an icon, and part of my past. So I want one from the past, one that is real, and not a recreation. None of which I have anything against, and I'm sure, to progress your point, I wouldn't be able to point out the real and the recreation.

We all have different needs and feelings about our cars, and I have waited a long time (in my eyes) for this car, whichever one it is. E.G. I spoke to a bloke in Wilmslow a short while ago. He got out of a White/Red RS; Quoth I, 'Is it a real one?' He smiled and said, 'No, it's a recreation, but the engine has been enlarged to 2.7.' I said, 'Doesn't matter, it still looks great!' He looked at the car and said,'I'll have a real one when the money comes along.' That's how I feel, except I didn't get the car inbetween, I waited. If only you knew how many times the T+S has quoted that conversation, and then said, 'But nobody else would know would they?'
But I would, and that's what's important.

For chums sake I'll assume that your 'I'm watching' comment wasn't tinged with sarcasm.....

But thanks again, it was a good point, and thanks for reading. I will update as I can, though some things I can't put on yet, but will at the right time.

BTW. It isn't nor will it ever be my intention to pay the price of the OZ car, had I decided that I couldn't live without it, then those chaps would have had a very cheeky offer indeed. It was meant as my benchmark for looking good, IMHO of course.

Cheers,

Steve.

sladey · Post by **sladey** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 12:10 pm

Hi Steve,

Thanks for the response. No sarcasm intended, I am interested to see how you get on.

I understand the need for the 'real deal' - I feel the same about my watch - couldn't have a replica. (but then a replica rolex is invariably cheaper and different, the replica RS's if done right are the same except for provenance)

Cheers

Mark

Spydermon · Post by **Spydermon** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 3:51 pm

sladey wrote:Hi Steve,

Thanks for the response. No sarcasm intended, I am interested to see how you get on.

I understand the need for the 'real deal' - I feel the same about my watch - couldn't have a replica. (but then a replica rolex is invariably cheaper and different, the replica RS's if done right are the same except for provenance)

Cheers

Mark

No worries! I know someone with a Breitling Bentley copy. It's all wrong; though visually simular, the weight is wrong and the second sweep is rubbish!

I was talking to Neil from Hairpin earlier; a very nice chap, and he answered my e-mail with a call, which I thought was a nice touch. He was very pleasant and chatty and not at all pushy, and refreshingly honest I felt.
The Gulf Blue RS is definitely sold

but they do have a really nice White/red recreation, which was owned by a very famous TV writer! Had I not already decided on a 'real' RS, then this would've been a very viable option, especially as it was built by Mark Waring, whose name has come up more than a few times.

So, point well made Sladey!

Cheers,

Steve.

Helen · Post by **Helen** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 4:16 pm

Spydermon wrote:
sladey wrote:Hi Steve,

Thanks for the response. No sarcasm intended, I am interested to see how you get on.

I understand the need for the 'real deal' - I feel the same about my watch - couldn't have a replica. (but then a replica rolex is invariably cheaper and different, the replica RS's if done right are the same except for provenance)

Cheers

Mark
No worries! I know someone with a Breitling Bentley copy. It's all wrong; though visually simular, the weight is wrong and the second sweep is rubbish!

I was talking to Neil from Hairpin earlier; a very nice chap, and he answered my e-mail with a call, which I thought was a nice touch. He was very pleasant and chatty and not at all pushy, and refreshingly honest I felt.
The Gulf Blue RS is definitely sold but they do have a really nice White/red recreation, which was owned by a very famous TV writer! Had I not already decided on a 'real' RS, then this would've been a very viable option, especially as it was built by Mark Waring, whose name has come up more than a few times.

So, point well made Sladey!

Cheers,

Steve.

his got a very nice and rare 930SE slant nose turbo in too,its one of only (approx) 50 built by hand in the factory... it's 100% original and only had one careful Lady owner

would keep you happy while you keep looking for a RS.. and you won't (unlikely anyway) loose any money on it.

Spydermon · Post by **Spydermon** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 8:30 pm

HI Helen,

Good pitch! Sorry but I'm not a fan of the slantnose, and the interior is a bit garish for me,.......................................................................................................................and...................................................I've already got a
<<ahem>> <<shuffles towards the door, retrieving coat>>

<<Whispers through hankie...>>

997.
I'm sorry.

Helen · Post by **Helen** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:23 pm

Spydermon wrote:HI Helen,

Good pitch! Sorry but I'm not a fan of the slantnose, and the interior is a bit garish for me,.......................................................................................................................and...................................................I've already got a
<<ahem>> <<shuffles towards the door, retrieving coat>>

<<Whispers through hankie...>>

997.
I'm sorry.

now that WILL loose you a shed load of money, unless you keep it for 10 years+

Spydermon · Post by **Spydermon** » Fri Jan 18, 2008 9:06 am

Helen wrote:
Spydermon wrote:HI Helen,

Good pitch! Sorry but I'm not a fan of the slantnose, and the interior is a bit garish for me,.......................................................................................................................and...................................................I've already got a
<<ahem>> <<shuffles towards the door, retrieving coat>>

<<Whispers through hankie...>>

997.
I'm sorry.

now that WILL loose you a shed load of money, unless you keep it for 10 years+

Told you there was a price with the T+S for the RS! Well that was it; doesn't want LHD (she was told there would be a good chance of the RS being such - well I say 'told', it was more, 'looooovvvvvve.'), so she wanted a 'modern' one!
I even had to go into an OPC and be talked at by a salesman, and '997' is all you're getting too, I'm never telling the spec............people might be watching.

And as for the ten years, well she'll have to keep it that long at least.....harrummphh indeed!

Steve.

Bertroex · Post by **Bertroex** » Fri Jan 18, 2008 11:56 am

Does she know about the fantastic 997 targa?

With hatch which comes in ever so handy for shopping?

Or is she opting for some PASM and biiiiig wheels?

Bert

Spydermon · Post by **Spydermon** » Fri Jan 18, 2008 12:57 pm

Bertroex wrote:Does she know about the fantastic 997 targa?

With hatch which comes in ever so handy for shopping?

Or is she opting for some PASM and biiiiig wheels?

Bert

Very perceptive Bert!

The first, though I haven't actually said that (allegedly), and it also may have a form of <<gasp>> <<whispers>> (automatic.)

You haven't seen me right?

Lightweight_911 · Post by **Lightweight_911** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 5:44 pm

You might also want to speak to Kevin Morfett @ Historika - he knows these cars inside out & owned (amongst many others) & restored an early RS in Tangerine back in the late '80's/early '90's that was the very best I've ever seen.

He is doing a bare metal restoration on an RS that he has for sale at the moment (he had 2 for sale last time I spoke to him) & you can guarantee that it will be correct in every detail.

His contact details are:

Tel: 01473 713989
Website: http://www.eurocars-uk.co.uk