Getting some perspective

[Tony]

Hi all, haven’t posted here for a bit but I thought the following might be of interest.

The uk produces around 1% of the worlds greenhouse gases. In reality this means if the UK stopped producing greenhouse gasses altogether - climate change will continue unabated. With regard just to CO2, worldwide man-made emissions account for just 3.5% of the total or to put it another way, perhaps vegetarianism is of greater value combating global warming than electric cars!

An article published in the Belgian media quoted research done by the University of Liège which argued that an electric car would have to travel 697,612 km before it would become green! After a storm of protest the professor involved revisited the research ( http://blogs.ulg.ac.be/damien-ernst/ele ... -or-false/) and revised the figures for a number of scenarios concluding that even in the most favourable case the minimum it would have to travel was 67,226 km.

Perhaps of significant interest to DDK, the UK has less classic cars than it has horses. Horses emit methane, some 30 times more powerful as a green house gas than CO2 (and yes horses emit methane even though they aren’t ruminants). Digging further and allowing for the fact these two populations will go up and down and the cars will do differing mileages it’s easy to make the case that classic cars contribute less to global warming in the UK than horses.Furthermore the classic car industry is worth more than the equine industry!

Now I don’t want to ban horses - but as with all the paragraphs above a little bit of perspective would be nice.

Tony

[cubist]

Vegetarianism will save our wheels? No, more Equestrianism will. Do like the Swiss, Germans, Polish and many others across Asia and eat the angry, flatulent buggers. 4.7 million feasted on per year already supposedly. 56% of our daily protein needs per 100g of horsey meat. Maybe Pret can quell the national consciousness and start offering The Seabiscuit meal deal: thin slices of prime marinated saddleback, shredded Suffolk Kale, lemon grass, mint sprigs and garlic mayo in a warm focaccia pocket. Root veggie crisps and a Pomegranate juice. Giddy up!

[Sam]

So we’re allowed to do anything less damaging to the environment than a horse? Seems a bit arbitrary but ok:

An average classic probably does c. 20mpg, so maybe 450g of co2 per mile.

A quick google suggests a horse makes 20kg of methane a year.

So if methane is 30x worse than co2 you need to keep your mileage under 1300 to be better for the world than a horsey.

Sounds doable.

Assuming you never replace or repair anything in your classic car, never change the oil, ignore the environmental cost of making fuel and the fact that horses mainly knock about in fields, away from people and cars mainly don’t so the direct deaths from air pollution don’t compare.

The UK’s % of emissions are of no relevance. It’s our individual output we can control, not our town’s or country’s or the whole planet’s.

I walk to work, don’t eat meat or drink milk, have electric heating in my house, don’t ride a horse and feed the dog mainly dry food for fewer botty burps. But I do have a classic car or three and, viruses permitting, I’m flying on holiday this year. I’m part of the problem, but I’m trying to do better without taking every bit of fun out of life. No point saving the world if we’re all bloody miserable in it, but self-justifying by saying we’re not as bad as horses or Emirates is nonsense. We should strive to be as good as the best, not a bit better than the worst.

[Sam]

Horse meat has about 20g of protein per 100g and is only easily available in Findus Crispy Pancakes in the UK. Peanut butter has 25 so you can get your daily requirement straight from the jar with a spoon in four goes.

Peanut butter will save us all.

[911hillclimber]

This can go on and on around the world.

An individual can only control their own approach to this topic, the politicians can only do so much but have the power to make things happen by guiding change while balancing economy and quality of life.
To address the issue of warming I feel it is far too late to stop it, but the rate of change can be changed, but I fail to see how.
I see no direction from the global leaders, just changes that are popular at a moment.
Engineers will find ways to improve things (ie EV's) if given direction, but every action taken has, in this world, to be a profit maker or protector.

There are simply too many people on this globe, all wanting an improved life, the numbers are huge.
If the planet lost 500 million across first world countries there would be a change...

That is not going to happen unless there is a very real war or plague or a law that nobody can have children for decades.

As an individual we can do our bit.
We are not doing a euro tour this year but taking a plane with 'green' EasyJet as we feel it is greener. It is the first plane we have taken for 3 years.
I don't know if driving the 15K a year I do is better in a (2014) diesel or petrol car.
Diesel will kill apparently people of which we have many, petrol will kill the planet of which we have one.

When our 40+ year old boiler goes kaput we should install an electric system. Doubt that will be cheaper than gas.

To make an individual difference means some hard changes, much restricted travel and changes in life style, I wrestle with this now and annoys the wife.

Also, as the UK is the 6th largest economy in the world (Radio 2 yesterday) surely we are responsible for more than 1% of the global emissions?

[Jonny Hart]

Things you can do right now:

1) if you have conventional heating, turn your hot water temperature down on your boiler. I don’t mean the central heating temp but heat of water out of the taps. Most are set to scalding.

2) buy local, stop buying ‘China crap’. Our emissions DO NOT include embedded emissions of imports. It is quite apparent how to stop the pollution. Just look at the NASA photos of China since the Covid 19 outbreak. Practically zero pollution in a few days!

3) negotiate a regular work from home day. If a company can’t accommodate this, then it shows poor management in my view.

4) check your food miles and know your seasons. All the winter fruit and veg from afar is crap anyway. The Spanish would never eat a strawberry or tomato out of season. A market has been created for us stupid Brits who mainly purchase on looks, not taste.

5) Cut down air travel. If you’re in the SE, Eurostar goes direct to a load of places now. There’s a car train from Düsseldorf down to a Italy too.

[Timo]

That is not going to happen unless there is a very real war or plague or a law that nobody can have children for decades.

A plague you say, or possibly a virus?

[911hillclimber]

You never know!
Will nature have a cull...very much doubt it, mankind will cull itself.

I've done most of Jonny's actions, I don't go to work anymore, but my car miles have not reduced. Must try harder.
We were very undecided about flying to Munich, but the Boxster Way seemed far more consuming than a plane which may not take off yet due to the virus.

UK exported a lot of pollution to China and I was part of that drive when I worked, so the UK pollution was exported over there to hang over their cities instead.

This is where all the information is so mis-leading, the true pollution of the UK is it's emissions AND the rubbish it takes to get the shelves filled from all over the place
Maybe it is just too difficult to work this all out with any reasonable accuracy or agreed method.
There is a formula for the cost of Living, cannot there be a formula for emissions?
For that to work every country would have to work to the same equations, at least those participating.

All politically charged which means it will never be agreed, and why I think there is not a solution to stop warming, but you can have a way to slow it down.
We will never remove the plastic from the sea, it is forever polluted, the air will be the same.

May have dreamt this but have the Arabs come up with a way to remove the CO2 'mechanically'.
Maybe we simply just grow far more trees at a crazy rate globally where they can grow?

In the back of my mind I'm thinking of changing my 2014 Skoda Superb Diesel for another one, but not sure which fuel.
I feel the current oil burners are really clean in comparison to my 2014 VAG which is a Diesel-Gate engine, modified by Skoda ages ago and it is a better engine since.
Any thoughts?

[Ollie]

I've always wondered the benefits to the climate to replacing an older car with a new car... surely better to keep the old one going for as long as reasonably possible thus reducing the requirememt for as many new cars to be produced.

Case in point... I've owned an old Audi A6 1.9tdi since 2006, its served me very well to date and I struggle to justify replacing it at this stage as it just keeps on going (save for a duff injector which may be the beginnig of the end!). Other people I know have been through the cycle of 3 year lease cars at least 4 times in this period...

Which one comes out on top from an environmental point of view... my dirty diesel or 4 new cars...?

[Sam]

There is a study somewhere that shows the most environmentally friendly car is the Jeep Wrangler 4.0.

Designed eons ago so the impact of the R&D process is minimal. Lasts forever, but if it does ever die it’s mainly made of pig iron so is totally recyclable with ease. Not many rare metals or petrol chemicals go into making it. And so on.

[911hillclimber]

Interesting.
My Skodais as solid as a rock, 60K miles.
A diesel at this age is not that clean, so save the planet by not buying a new car and let a taxi driver kill the car instead, but a new one is cleaner by a mile to breath.

Maybe not that easy a decision to make?

[Jonny Hart]

‘Consumer choice’ used to be regarded as a good thing. Now we have a situation where there is plenty of apparent choice yet most of the products share one common attribute - short time to landfill. E.g. there are 113,000 usb sticks listed on eBay right now. Why? How is this good? Idiotic.

[Jonny Hart]

That is not going to happen unless there is a very real war or plague or a law that nobody can have children for decades.

A plague you say, or possibly a virus?

‘Oh, if and when the laws of man
Is not just, equal and fair
Then the laws of nature
Will come and do her thang’. - George Clinton (1972)

[911hillclimber]

Maybe she is currently doing her best, just slowly.

[gridgway]

There’s a car train from Düsseldorf down to a Italy too.

OT, but I think it's no more