RHD conversion to a longhood 911/912

[gridgway]

My "stealth bomber" was an 89 LHD to RHD conversion. It was very good (apparently) as quite a few people who looked at it didn't realise (some did).

For me the driving position was fine.

But it has a huge stigma, to my mind much worse than a backdate. Not sure why that is.

Graham

[Ralph]

I like that!

[PeterK]

Me too

[911hillclimber]

Graham:
I'm sure it is the education everyone gets today from so many places that things are good/bad in classic cars and it is always about money today.

Only the best (expensive) cars have Matching Numbers, and correct headed bolts and roof linings diagonal and not straight etc. Easy to understand.
Cars that have seen actions that few understand, LHD/RHD for example, sunroof added, injection from carbs or vice versa, raced too are a worry, so the price has to drop to a level which allays the fears.

Also called bargaining tools as taught by Wheeler Dealers, and to be used by seller and buyer alike.

Lots of USA E Types, TR's Healeys etc have been rebuilt with conversions and seem to pass many by (I know people with such cars) and it is acceptable. RHD is desirable, it is safer and convenient, if it wasn't so, every car in England would be LHD?

Recently, during my doubts about keeping my 911 I had offers of £35 and 40K for the car, probably not bad for a hot rod. In both cases each knew of the RHD conversion and it had been hill climbed hard for 13 years etc. and had a fabric sun roof.
If the car was still LHD? Goodness knows the value, possibly another 5K?

Taken a year ago, you can see most of the weld runs I used. These are not the welds, but the seal sealer over them!



Looks OK to me, an ex competition car after all.





Ralph, I did the 'history' bit while the car was partly apart for last winter's re-paint. It was the first time the dash pad was off since 1993, hope it gets discovered in the future.

[gridgway]

Graham:
I'm sure it is the education everyone gets today from so many places that things are good/bad in classic cars and it is always about money today.

Yep, the car was brilliant, after the conversion it went back to bare metal to be sprayed. It also was a complete hot-rod, so I had no idea why being a US import left to right conversion should cause so much consternation!

Like most cars I've sold, I'd quite like it back!

Graham

[sladey]

Lots of USA E Types, TR's Healeys etc have been rebuilt with conversions and seem to pass many by (I know people with such cars) and it is acceptable. RHD is desirable, it is safer and convenient, if it wasn't so, every car in England would be LHD?

That’s not really comparable Graham - those cars were built from the off to be easily switchable as the US market was massive for them - the pressings made it a relatively easy change to make. On the 911 it’s never been easy as so many structural panels need changing and welding

[IanM]

But i would want RHD.....so conversion:

Why conversion? Buy a real RHD. They are still out there.

How much are you prepared to spend?

[PMNorris]

You can check out Home Built by Jeff on Youtube. His car was originally a badly done LHD to RHD conversion. He had to redo a lot of the badly done conversion parts. He is only now fitting the engine and has had to install fly by wire accelerator parts as the accelerator wouldn't fit. It looks like a lot of hard work to me.
I have recently relocated from Switzerland to the UK and find driving my LHD 911 in the UK no problem at all. I wouldn't change it. It's so narrow you can almost drive in the middle of the road anyway.

[911hillclimber]

Just had to go and find it!
I missed the first episodes of Jeff's re-build.
It is all shown in Episode #2, recovery to the bulkhead is #8. Quite a job done!

Interesting he did not go back to LHD or are there Australian rules about rhd in the country?

[PMNorris]

From memory he wanted an RHD car and the one he bought was cheap. However, there are restrictions on LHD cars in Aus, but the rules vary by state.

[Nige]

I drive both LHD and RHD on a regular basis and have a different opinion to James as I never notice the difference and both feel as good as each other.......I'd never bother converting, just drive what you get and enjoy

Same here, never felt any discernible difference between the two, both have equal disadvantages and advantages that cancel each other out. Really don't see the point for a shed load of hassle and expense.

[b4wrc]

Sorry to revive an old thread but I am just getting my car back on the road after a long spell dormant in my garage. I am completely with Hillclimber on all points. You see my car is a 1973 shell with turbo arches and one of the afore mentioned Club Autos LHD to RHD conversions. I bought this in 1987 when these cars were not so precious and these conversions didn't matter so much. I wanted a RHD car so it fitted the bill. It works well and has been no problem over the years. The car is a complete mongrel 3.0 s engine RS recreation. I fitted turbo Bilstein's front and rear turbo torsion bars it is as light as comfortably possible. The main thing is I like it and will keep it for as long as I can drive it. I am 67 now and remember the time when Mk1 and MK2 Escorts, Minis and Porsches were just cars that could be raced, rallied with impunity and it didn't really matter what we did to them to keep them running and racing. Sadly those days are long gone and now originality provenance and money dominate. I cannot believe the values attributed to cars that have any form of competition heritage no matter how tenuous, and believe me some of the claims are just that!!

[Barry]

Just to chime in having been off DDK for yonks, so new to this thread.

I converted my original blue 2.4T from dreadful LHD Tonka Toy 'Kramer' (ish) flat-nose very wide body to a RHD narrow car. It started life in Viper, went through a ton of colour changes including bronze, I got it in Guards and after bare metal did it in Gulf.

To put things in context, I paid £2k for it with a spare 2.4E engine (sans induction stuff). Ahh, happy days although that was around 2004-5 when even £2k for a major project wasn't that unusual.

Anyway, to the nub of this: I got hold of a front clip from a RHD car which gave pedal area, dash, entire bulkhead, smuggler's box, pedal box and a few other bits. I think the clip was impact bumper but pre-brake servo as I don't remember blanking that area off.

To do this 'properly' (on the understanding that things have changed and you don't do the conversion at all these days) you take the entire bulkhead out, just leaving the chassis number area. E.g. you are left with the scuttle hanging in air, the vertical portion of the luggage bay (normally covered by the fuel tank, and that's it. No smuggler's box, you go right down to the floor-pan. The 'new' bulkhead needs to be folded in at the extremities near the A-post tops and then gets folded back out later. This is just enough to allow you to jiggle it into position.

It is a lot of work but in terms of end product, if done as above there's no structural worries at all: nothing compared to someone poorly fitting sills with iffy welds too far apart.

These days I would be much helped by having my front screen jig, but I do remember being very careful to make sure I referenced the front screen aperture at the time. Screen later went in as a DIY with no issues.

So ... the bulkhead had no extra joins over an original RHD car, had all the correct details, original chassis number, correct smuggler's box and lid and the car still runs around today at least fifteen years later.

I sold it and then not long after bought from Mr Moss a RHD converted 2.4E. Nick was sufficiently dis.gusted with it to threaten to break it up. My inherently lower standards let me use it and enjoy it before selling it on with all foibles disclosed. That was pretty roughly done but again had used a decent donor. Again, still running around today I think by the chap that bought from me. Would quite fancy that one back again actually!

There was at least one famous DDK car that sold for serious money that was actually a conversion on the quiet. My blue car was an import so I needed it inspecting post resto / conversion to get a reg. I trailed it down and the inspector came out with a group of inspectorate and police trainees. They were being trained in how to spot altered cars, ringers and poor repairs. They asked if they could work their way through my car and for 30mins I watched the instructor tell the group how the car was clearly original and all how it should be. Once finished I fetched out my photos

Would I do one now for myself? Actually, if I'd picked up, say, a rough LHD SC (or whatever) and just fancied a RHD backdate and had a RHD donor clip, yes I probably would. I wouldn't do it for anyone else and I wouldn't do it to a nice original car. I wouldn't do a half conversion although completely understand and appreciate why they were done (and in large numbers) at the time. I do like the idea of sort of repeating where I started though: just take an absolute hopeless pig and turn it into an early looking, narrow body coupe. I'll have it in Leaf Green please ...

BTW I'll never forget the feeling walking into my home workshop on Christmas morning having ripped the bulkhead / dash out the evening before. That was a mighty big hole to see! Had it not been for the little scuttle panel wobbling in the air, I could have just walked into the car via the luggage bay.

Oh yes, I extended the loom using aircraft-grade fittings. Worked perfectly just taking it one wire at a time.

[911hillclimber]

Interesting read from one so respected.
Many ways to skin a cat, and from these real examples, mine included, all on the road and seemingly trouble free.
The world was very different in the 80s when it seems many of these cuts were done.

[Barry]

I completely agree Graham. As you say, many of these cars are running around perfectly happily donkeys years later. Nevertheless, yours must have been by far one of the better ones at the time.

Just as there were some very good quality ones there were some absolute shockers. I saw one either last year or possibly year before when called out for a quote. It must have been performed on an isolated island as the only tools to hand were obviously an axe and an old arc welder.

But ... context, context. It probably stopped the car from being scrapped.

I just happened to stumble on someone that had done lots of cars over the years who also had some spare RHD metal he wanted to shift. I took a van and roughly £500 and came back with everything for the conversion including, I think, a set of 16's as well. Different times as they say.